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Vogtlands vs Eibach

G

GTpEazy

New member
I guess the title is kinda self explanatory but I was wondering which would be better... I'm set on a strut/spring combo and I'm going with the most basic GR2s (they're cheap and if they get the job done whatever) ... So I read up Eibachs = more handling focus with bad ride, Vogtlands tho are kinda vague, most of the comments I read about Vogtlands are comfortable but not much is said about the handling. I also read on this forum Vogtland's spring rates are very similar to the Eibach's. Vogtlands seem like the more ideal choice on the GR2s since they drop only about an inch or so but how much body roll are the Vogtlands gonna control? How about the grip levels between the 2 (I'd assume they'd be similar since they've got similar spring rates, same with the body roll). I'd rather not have the 34 mm front sway bar and stick with the stock 28 mm to have as much grip up front as possible and would prefer to control body roll with springs instead of the front sway bar, but I'd also rather not overwhelm the GR2s. Anyone have experience with these?

Edit: ik the Vogtlands came with the original GMPP w/ Koni kit so I'd kinda assume they'd be ideal all the way around (including handling), but unlike the original GMPP I'd like to keep the oe 28 mm front sway bar with maybe poly bushings and run a 22 mm rear addco bar so most of the grip lies up front and the rear is relatively easy to rotate.
 


It's a GP, it's not going to handle like it's on rails but lowering with good tires helps.

You can always go with SSC springs to bet right in the middle.
 
Fivefingerdeathpunch said:
It's a GP, it's not going to handle like it's on rails but lowering with good tires helps.

You can always go with SSC springs to bet right in the middle.
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Yeah I figured the limits of the W-body platform. But if the GXP proved anything, it can be taken to new levels and you CAN make an all around GT car that may not handle like a Miata but can grip as hard as modern GT cars and can at least be decently track capable. I'm not trying to autox this car, hence the whole keeping the front soft thing... I don't mind a bit of body roll up front but tighten it as stiff as needed to slightly improve responsiveness and have as much grip there as I can get with 245s both a. 420 treadwear A/S tires and b. 200 treadwear summer tires... SSCs seem like a solid choice tho, but I'm not sure if the GR2's can handle the drop, SSCs seem like a good deal since it lowers more than the other 2 and spring rate again about the same, but a little less than the other 2... so I assume a little less body lean than the other 2... decisions decisions :\
 
The Guz said:
Eibachs tend to sag in the rear.
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Ewghhhh that sucks, but for the sake of this argument let's say that doesn't matter... (if I were to buy Eibach I'd use WBS rear springs which are stiffer than the front and drop only 1"). You have the GMPP handling kit with vogtlands I'm hoping, I assume your car handles similarly to a Comp G, but how do you think the springs only would affect your performance leaving the sway bars out of the question
 


I ran SSC's with GR2 struts for almost 2 years I think.

I'll admit that there was still some "pogo" to the suspension at times, it would be a slightly bouncy depending on road condition or what kinda bumps you hit but overall the struts can handle the drop good. I also did not have a front sway bar on the car, it had broke in half from the every common rust/cheapness and I never got around to replacing it. It would have handled alot better with it for sure.

Also, you can buy SSC from canuck motorsports. They make the springs anyway, instead of buying through another vendor. The price is also cheaper, I think I paid like 170ish for them like 2-3 years ago.
 
theaceofspades said:
Buy Vogtlands and an addco rear sway you won't regret it


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Sounds so good right now, I might need to buy a new stock front sway bar tho... I don't know the current condition of it but I might find out it's cracked once I get down there... I'll prolly replace it with an oe 28 mm one with stock rubber bushings I guess, keep stock lcas w/ moog bushings, bmr rear trailing arms, I'm gonna order an Addco bar from summit racing but it'll probably be winter by the time I actually get it so I might as well wait till the spring to put it on. The only conflict I have is in the springs... Vogtlands sound so good since they seem a more of a 'mature' drop if you will, more OE style but still slightly higher spring rate with a small drop, but like fivefinger said the SSC springs are good also... so Eibachs crossed out, now I have to decide whether I want Vogtlands or SSCs... :\
 
While you are at it.. you may as well look over the Regal build pictures I have here somewhere.

That was on GR2's with Vogtlands, the rear still looked saggy, even on new parts. But .. while you are adding all these new parts.. do the drag, toe and lateral bars.
 
BillBoost37 said:
While you are at it.. you may as well look over the Regal build pictures I have here somewhere.

That was on GR2's with Vogtlands, the rear still looked saggy, even on new parts. But .. while you are adding all these new parts.. do the drag, toe and lateral bars.
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Might as well and aren't the GP's rear fenders shaped different than the regal's (well obviously but you get what I mean)?
 


Go Dorman for the Front sway, it's 33mm and solid. For the control arms, look into the Problemsolver bushing from Moog. NOT the Problemsolver control arm, because it doesn't come with the Problemsolver bushing installed. Stupid Moog. Save your money on the trailing arms, and just get some Dormans. BMR isn't any better, other than the bushings. Save your money for the lateral arms, that's where you'll see the biggest difference in handling.
 
GTpEazy said:
Ewghhhh that sucks, but for the sake of this argument let's say that doesn't matter... (if I were to buy Eibach I'd use WBS rear springs which are stiffer than the front and drop only 1"). You have the GMPP handling kit with vogtlands I'm hoping, I assume your car handles similarly to a Comp G, but how do you think the springs only would affect your performance leaving the sway bars out of the question
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I don't know what a comp g handles like but I have had the GMPP for years. I've had B&G's with GR2's at one point and they sat very low in the rear. The struts wore out fairly quickly and the pogo for me was just too much. So that's when I went the GMPP route and I am glad I did.

My brother has vogtlands and AGX's and the ride is close to the GMPP set up I have.

theaceofspades said:
Buy Vogtlands and an addco rear sway you won't regret it


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I agree with this along with upgrading the front sway bar.
 
Booba5185 said:
Go Dorman for the Front sway, it's 33mm and solid. For the control arms, look into the Problemsolver bushing from Moog. NOT the Problemsolver control arm, because it doesn't come with the Problemsolver bushing installed. Stupid Moog. Save your money on the trailing arms, and just get some Dormans. BMR isn't any better, other than the bushings. Save your money for the lateral arms, that's where you'll see the biggest difference in handling.
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There will be no lateral grip loss with the bigger front sway right? I'm only asking because I don't want the front overall roll rate to be so stiff that the inside front tire starts picking up (kinda similar phenomenon to excessive body roll I guess)... but then again these cars do have a LOT of chassis LEAN but the goal is to keep it as soft as possible to a point where it'll grip but stiff enough where it corners at least a bit flatter. I don't quite know how much of an impact the dorman makes mated to the Vogtlands so that's why I'm asking you. And yeah I was only gonna get the bushings but that's really weird how they don't supply the bushings w/ their control arms... odd... as far as trailing arms go, note taken, will go for BMR lateral arms and Dorman trailing arms instead.
 
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GTpEazy said:
Might as well and aren't the GP's rear fenders shaped different than the regal's (well obviously but you get what I mean)?
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I know the shape of the GP rear quarter is more square-ish making it look like its sagging more than the front when in reality it's not. Not sure about the Regals.
 
You'll be beefing up the back, so you'll want to beef up the front a bit. Dorman is the way to go on the front sway, it's been tested many times. Moog does supply bushings in their control arms, just not the good problem solver bushing. I have Vogtlands (with anti-pogo washers), GMPP rear trailing arms (with custom PITA poly bushings), Vogtlands, STBs, Dorman front sway, Addco rear sway, Moog endlinks front and back, rebuilt LCAs (with that Moog bushing I was talking about), and I think that's it, lol. I still have some Monroe gas struts in there since I bought them before I went the performance route on suspension, I will be changing them out for AGX's at some point (whenever they go bad). Truthfully it handles very well, I'm surpised how the Monroes work, but I'll still get something better. Why replace something that isn't bad yet? I also don't have any lateral arm upgrades yet, but they are coming, the AGX's and the lateral arms are all I have left...unless I want to go coil over...but I live in the country so that's not gonna happen. If your curious, this is how it sits not, I think the Vogtlands are settled by now.
94NULdr.jpg
 


Booba5185 said:
You'll be beefing up the back, so you'll want to beef up the front a bit. Dorman is the way to go on the front sway, it's been tested many times. Moog does supply bushings in their control arms, just not the good problem solver bushing. I have Vogtlands (with anti-pogo washers), GMPP rear trailing arms (with custom PITA poly bushings), Vogtlands, STBs, Dorman front sway, Addco rear sway, Moog endlinks front and back, rebuilt LCAs (with that Moog bushing I was talking about), and I think that's it, lol. I still have some Monroe gas struts in there since I bought them before I went the performance route on suspension, I will be changing them out for AGX's at some point (whenever they go bad). Truthfully it handles very well, I'm surpised how the Monroes work, but I'll still get something better. Why replace something that isn't bad yet? I also don't have any lateral arm upgrades yet, but they are coming, the AGX's and the lateral arms are all I have left...unless I want to go coil over...but I live in the country so that's not gonna happen. If your curious, this is how it sits not, I think the Vogtlands are settled by now.
94NULdr.jpg
Click to expand...

The doorman bar isn't adjustable by any chance, is it? Your car looks really nice, love those bullit mustang wheels, I've got a set of 5 spoke 114.3x5 mustang wheels myself. One thing you didn't mention tho is what tires are you running? What size? Like I mentioned in the beginning for the rest of winter/DD I'm doing UHP A/S tires, most likely Ecsta 4xes since tire rack has a $100 rebate on kumhos for october. Tire sizs im planning on running are 245/45s up front and probably 225/55s in the rear basically taking a page out of the GXP's book. Im hoping these tires max lateral grip will be in the mid .8s (comparable to like a comp-g or an old 328i... with the <200 tw summer tires im hoping the grip will be similar to like the turbo Cobalts
 
Just stick with 245/45 18s that way you can rotate them. Going with a 225/55 in the rear is going to do nothing for you.


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REDCOMPG said:
Just stick with 245/45 18s that way you can rotate them. Going with a 225/55 in the rear is going to do nothing for you.


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Interesting you say that, some people prefer a staggered stance on fwd but why do you say stay square?
 
No they don't lol. On a rwd yea staggered a way to go. Fwd..nope. There's a reason when it come time for the gxp guys to buy new rubbers 98% of them will just go with 245/45 all the way around.


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