Anthony Smith
New member
I love my Comp 76-802-9. Bigger than a VS smaller than a XP. Great powerband, run 15k so far flawlessly with my l76 springs. Paid somewhere around $270 wholesale for it instead of $330 for a ZZP grind
XP/VS/S1X cam's
- Thread starter JDrach
- Start date
Swiggles
Donating User
Man someone needs to make a sticky with this questions...
I've run both the xp and the vs. the was with stage 3 heads and 1.7 rockers though. I enjoyed the all the time power of the vs, great cam and the car should've come with that cam from gm if you ask me. I loved the top end power of the xp though. If you looking for good power with a nice lobe sound at idle go with the xp. If you want all around power for some more fun in lower rpms and little bit of a sleeper cam (doesnt really sound cammed at idle) then go with the xp.
I never ran an s1x but they are closer to the xp than the vs from what I've read.
I've run both the xp and the vs. the was with stage 3 heads and 1.7 rockers though. I enjoyed the all the time power of the vs, great cam and the car should've come with that cam from gm if you ask me. I loved the top end power of the xp though. If you looking for good power with a nice lobe sound at idle go with the xp. If you want all around power for some more fun in lower rpms and little bit of a sleeper cam (doesnt really sound cammed at idle) then go with the xp.
I never ran an s1x but they are closer to the xp than the vs from what I've read.
AjL227
New member
I've got 27k miles on my XP cam w/ Rollmaster double roller & Comp 105# valve springs. No issues here on a 2.6" pulley @ 13 psi.
It is definitely a nice, fun and reliable daily driver.
I figure it like this...
If you're going to go through the trouble of installing a cam, you want to do it right the first time.
Any larger cam profile on a single roller chain will end up chewing up the plastic tensioner, do you want to go back every 30-40k miles and replace a piece of plastic?
Much less having the thought of said plastic breaking and costing you another long block.
I didn't think so.
In order to rid yourself of this issue, you will require a double roller timing chain, machined to proper specs.
Like other members have stated, even with the VS it is highly recommended you upgrade springs and retainers.
So...for complete peace of mind you're looking at installing a double roller timing chain and at least 90#+ valve springs anyway.
Why not get the most lift and duration for the same amount of work?
Go XP.
On a final note...I know someone who ran a VS with stock chain and 105# valve springs.
He was quickly cruising on the highway going 85-90MPH @ ~2600RPM when his stock chain snapped and cost him 2 pistons and 4 valves.
It is definitely a nice, fun and reliable daily driver.
I figure it like this...
If you're going to go through the trouble of installing a cam, you want to do it right the first time.
Any larger cam profile on a single roller chain will end up chewing up the plastic tensioner, do you want to go back every 30-40k miles and replace a piece of plastic?
Much less having the thought of said plastic breaking and costing you another long block.
I didn't think so.
In order to rid yourself of this issue, you will require a double roller timing chain, machined to proper specs.
Like other members have stated, even with the VS it is highly recommended you upgrade springs and retainers.
So...for complete peace of mind you're looking at installing a double roller timing chain and at least 90#+ valve springs anyway.
Why not get the most lift and duration for the same amount of work?
Go XP.
On a final note...I know someone who ran a VS with stock chain and 105# valve springs.
He was quickly cruising on the highway going 85-90MPH @ ~2600RPM when his stock chain snapped and cost him 2 pistons and 4 valves.
JDrach
New member
I just hate getting different opinions from people who say one thing about one and then someone else has an opposing view on them. I read Orange's comparison of the two since he had them both and it seems like the VS is safer and better for daily driving around town. In all honesty by the sounds of it, i dont believe i'd be around the powerband of the XP often to gain its potential where the VS's powerband is more in my range. Ya the XP will prolly be better for 1/4's, but i dont really think I'll need that power on the top end cause i dont really go to the track.
GTPpower
New member
You're going to find that anywhere though. Everyone is going to know someone that's an exception to the rule. The rule of thumb, is to switch to the double rollmaster if you're running a higher spring pressure than 110# with a 1.8" install height. Most guys that run 105# springs will just run a new stock timing chain and new dampner. That way, you don't have to deal with the more difficult install of the double roller, and the extra noise that it produces. If it was my car, I would put in a VS cam, new timing chain and dampner, PBM 110# springs and never worry about it again.
GTPpower
New member
The VS will be more economical at low rpms without boost. That is what he is after, guys. The 20 peak horsepower that he will give up by staying away from the XP won't ever matter to him.
Crow 105# springs are lsx style, so you will need an lsx style retainer. They are cheap from the dealer. Or, you can get them from the many vendors this community has.
Crow 105# springs are lsx style, so you will need an lsx style retainer. They are cheap from the dealer. Or, you can get them from the many vendors this community has.
darkhorizon
New member
LSA makes it "sound" bigger... go **** off please.
JDrach
New member
or these for the crow 105 springs? INTENSE-Racing.com: Manley Performance Valvespring Retainers
LOBE SEPARATION ANGLE (LSA)
A camshaft consists of intake and exhaust lobes, and a key consideration when designing a cam is the lobe separation angle, sometimes also called the lobe displacement angle, or lobe spread. The definition here is simply the distance in degrees, as measured on the cam, between the point of peak lift on the intake lobe and the peak lift on the exhaust lobe. There are several measurements found in a cam's specs, which give clues to the performance characteristics of a given grind. Some, such as lift and duration, are easy enough for even the neophyte camshaft connoisseur to understand. These are often the only specs considered when selecting a cam. Really, for any given lobe, that's all there is, lift and duration, and the two can be related to map the profile of a lobe throughout its lift cycle. Though lift and duration alone can fully describe an individual lobe, each cylinder of an engine has intake and exhaust lobes, and the timing of these events relative to each other have a significant influence on engine performance. Neither lift nor duration gives any clue as to this aspect of a cam's design. Lobe separation angle does.
Simply put, the lobe separation angle (LSA) is a measurement of how the intake and exhaust lobes are phased with each other. To establish the position of each lobe, the traditional reference point is where the lobes reach max lift. Picturing the end-view of a cam as a circle with 360 degrees; the lobe separation is a measurement in degrees of the distance between the max lift on the exhaust and intake lobes, respectively. Note that degrees of lobe separation angle are given in a simple degree measurement at the cam, in contrast to how duration is measured as degrees of rotation of the crank, which turns at twice the cam's speed. With this in mind, lobe separation angle is said to be in cam degrees, while duration is quoted as crank degrees.It's not astonishing to us that lobe separation will have a big impact on performance. After all, the valve timing events have to occur at the most advantageous moments to glean the desired results from an engine combo. Obviously a LSA of zero would have the intake and exhaust valves open and close at the same time and even we know this won't work. Cam grinders are pretty sharp on this subject, and have found the sweet range for LSAs in the range of 104-115 degrees for most applications. Typical off-the-self aftermarket cams will have a lobe spread between these values, with the greatest number of offerings falling toward the middle of this range. Coincidence? We think it's a pretty safe bet that they've got a handle on what works, and grind their cams accordingly.
Even within this relatively narrow range, the lobe separation angles will affect engine performance. The following chart gives some of the general haracteristics you'll see with two otherwise identical cams ground on narrow or wide lobe separation angles, assuming they are installed with the same amount of advance.A camshaft consists of intake and exhaust lobes, and a key consideration when designing a cam is the lobe separation angle, sometimes also called the lobe displacement angle, or lobe spread. The definition here is simply the distance in degrees, as measured on the cam, between the point of peak lift on the intake lobe and the peak lift on the exhaust lobe. There are several measurements found in a cam's specs, which give clues to the performance characteristics of a given grind. Some, such as lift and duration, are easy enough for even the neophyte camshaft connoisseur to understand. These are often the only specs considered when selecting a cam. Really, for any given lobe, that's all there is, lift and duration, and the two can be related to map the profile of a lobe throughout its lift cycle. Though lift and duration alone can fully describe an individual lobe, each cylinder of an engine has intake and exhaust lobes, and the timing of these events relative to each other have a significant influence on engine performance. Neither lift nor duration gives any clue as to this aspect of a cam's design. Lobe separation angle does.
Simply put, the lobe separation angle (LSA) is a measurement of how the intake and exhaust lobes are phased with each other. To establish the position of each lobe, the traditional reference point is where the lobes reach max lift. Picturing the end-view of a cam as a circle with 360 degrees; the lobe separation is a measurement in degrees of the distance between the max lift on the exhaust and intake lobes, respectively. Note that degrees of lobe separation angle are given in a simple degree measurement at the cam, in contrast to how duration is measured as degrees of rotation of the crank, which turns at twice the cam's speed. With this in mind, lobe separation angle is said to be in cam degrees, while duration is quoted as crank degrees.It's not astonishing to us that lobe separation will have a big impact on performance. After all, the valve timing events have to occur at the most advantageous moments to glean the desired results from an engine combo. Obviously a LSA of zero would have the intake and exhaust valves open and close at the same time and even we know this won't work. Cam grinders are pretty sharp on this subject, and have found the sweet range for LSAs in the range of 104-115 degrees for most applications. Typical off-the-self aftermarket cams will have a lobe spread between these values, with the greatest number of offerings falling toward the middle of this range. Coincidence? We think it's a pretty safe bet that they've got a handle on what works, and grind their cams accordingly.
Even within this relatively narrow range, the lobe separation angles will affect engine performance. The following chart gives some of the general characteristics you'll see with two otherwise identical cams ground on narrow or wide lobe separation angles, assuming they are installed with the same amount of advance.
EFFECTS OF LOBE SEPARATION ANGLE
LSA NARROW WIDE
Intake Open Earlier Later
Intake Close Earlier Later
Exhaust Open Later Earlier
Overlap More Less
Cylinder Pressure Gain Lose
Idle Quality Worse Better
Idle Vacuum Less More
Torque Curve Peakier Flatter
Peak Torque More Less
High RPM Drops Off Hangs On
blueguy
The Blue One
Hi Bry bry.
Actually Scott, the smaller the LSA the choppier it is...so yeah, your S1X magic doesn't make it technically larger than the XP. But it's beating a dead horse with you...you're never wrong.
So, you go **** off.
Maybe next time we'll toss a few points in for you?
Merry Christmas, happy.
Actually Scott, the smaller the LSA the choppier it is...so yeah, your S1X magic doesn't make it technically larger than the XP. But it's beating a dead horse with you...you're never wrong.
So, you go **** off.
Maybe next time we'll toss a few points in for you?
Merry Christmas, happy.