Transgo shiftkit question

[Abaer1997]

Bought a transgo shiftkit to try n help out some of the long/hard shifting that my 4t65e has been experiencing. Got it and was just reading over instructions before tearing into here in a couple days. Few questions....

1- the kit has tips that says to replace pressure control solenoid and the needle bearings. How necessary is this?

2- it includes a special seal for people having problems with no reverse or trouble with the reverse slipping when it's cold. I'm not having this trouble, should i put this new seal in anyways?

3- it says to replace the rings on the (input drum?) Is this necessary?

I have never done anything like this but it seems pretty do able. I just don't want to screw anything up so any other thoughts/ advice would be much appreciated! Thanks!

 

[GTPpower]

Bought a transgo shiftkit to try n help out some of the long/hard shifting that my 4t65e has been experiencing. Got it and was just reading over instructions before tearing into here in a couple days. Few questions....

1- the kit has tips that says to replace pressure control solenoid and the needle bearings. How necessary is this?

2- it includes a special seal for people having problems with no reverse or trouble with the reverse slipping when it's cold. I'm not having this trouble, should i put this new seal in anyways?

3- it says to replace the rings on the (input drum?) Is this necessary?

I have never done anything like this but it seems pretty do able. I just don't want to screw anything up so any other thoughts/ advice would be much appreciated! Thanks!

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the pcs is in the valve body. You have to remove the side cover to get to, which is usually done by pulling the trans. Assuming it also is talking about the stator support bearings, those are also accessible only through the side cover.

The seal for reverse is a good idea to replace, but you have to remove the exhaust crossover, which can be a huge pain.

The rings on the input drum are also only accessible through the side cover.

I'd skip everything besides the reverse servo seal...and possibly even that.

 

[3800sofine]

the only parts you can put in from the transgo shift kit are the 1-2 and 2-3 accumulator spacers and springs, by dropping the pan.
the rest of the stuff you have to pull the side pan and that is a major job- requiring a lift unless you want to work like a slave on the ground on blocks bent over.
if you are having hard shift problems, cut the brown wire to TCC clutch at bottom of harness on trans.
it will save you a lot of headaches diagnosing these transmissions.
the problem with these is, a total trans rebuild with new converter is banging on $3,000
and these cars due to age, aren't even worth that barely.
in my case I could buy another Monte Carlo SS for $2800 with a perfect body and interior nicer than mine, with half the mileage.

 

[SaukRapids]

cut the brown wire to TCC clutch at bottom of harness on trans

a total trans rebuild with new converter is banging on $3,000

I haven't heard any advice to cut wires on the trans harness before...

3 grand is a good starting point if you want a TEP trans. The cost is well justified for some owners.

 

[3800sofine]

I've been working on cars as a mechanic since 1980. I'm 55 years old now. had 3 Grand Prixs. still have a GTO and Firebird I bought when I was 19.
had my own garage for 7 years, and worked in the business directly doing repairs/rebuilds for 12 years. other than that as a hobby and side business-
and have a degree in Automotive Technology.
now, having said that, before the 4t65e, the older GM automatics had a separate plug to just unplug the TCC.
my Dad bought an '88 Olds Cutlass w/3.8 1st gen brand new- and the trans TCC stuck on it and would stall the car after only about 70k miles
the mechanic told him, we can either do a transmission, or just unplug the TCC-
he unplugged the TCC and drove the car for another 75k miles. it still ran when my Mom junked it in 2008 for $450
all the first gen GM TCC equipped cars, eventually had the TCC unplugged. it just was not worth the big repair bill to fix the trans, when the TCC stuck on.
keep in mind before 1980 there were no clutches in the transmission, period. the only reason they are there, is to meet Fed mileage mandates-
otherwise the car is deemed a "gas guzzler" and taxed on the sticker price if it doesn't meet the standards
now- you can either spend $3,000 to spoon feed this poor design when the TCC goes out...
or, you can just cut the wire.
what they did was, made the TCC circuit integral to all the other trans controls, in one harness, so you can't unplug it on a 4t65e
but you can just snip the wire, and it runs just fine.
your choice. I'm only telling you how it works. it costs nothing to cut the wire, clear the codes, and disconnect the battery to clear the TAPS
it costs a schitload of money to rebuild the entire trans and change the converter.
because if you re-use the old converter, you are still going to have the problem- the clutch in the converter is non-replaceable,
unless you have the converter CUT OPEN at a converter shop, and a new clutch installed. big bucks.
we are talking cars that are 10+ years old now, and barely worth $3,000. there's a ton of Grand Prixs for sale for under $2000
it makes no sense to spend $3000 on a trans, for a $2000 car.
not for a V6 powered FWD. If it was a '64 GTO 389-tripower, hell yeh.
there's an investment.
but these new FWD cars will never bring the money the old ones bring....so it's money thrown down the drain.
putting a $3k trans in, you will never recover those repair costs with a newer car. they just don't have the same collector value- and never will.
the truth of the matter is, a TCC has no right being inside an automatic trans converter, having a friction clutch cycling like that on/off, is cutting material off the clutch like a lathe, and that dust ends up IN THE FLUID, and jams up all the valves and solenoids in the valve body.
GM's lame asz approach was put a magnet, or 2, inside the pan to catch the dust.
it's a wonder these trans run as long as they do, considering this. I put 210k on my '01 before it schit the bed, and had no 3-4 gears. before that it had a stuck TCC and hard shifting. and my son's '03 went 185k before the TCC stuck on, and had hard shifting- and I cut the wire. it was like day and night. it shifted ok then. if it wasn't for the sloppy 1-2 shift, I would still be driving it that way- if it was only my car- but he complained, and it needed the 1-2 shift solenoid to fix 1-2 shift. so we changed them all. to date still have not re-connected the TCC wire.
because I fear it will drive more clutch particles into the NEW TCC solenoid, and jam that up as well- if I reconnect the wire.
once it permanently jams the TCC on, it also gets hard shifts 1-2-3-4, the 2 problems go hand in hand.

 

[SaukRapids]

Barking up the wrong tree if you're trying to iterate that these transmissions are glass. That's well known.

I'm glad you got your fix to work by cutting the wire.

There's no question the value of these cars. People still spend thousands of dollars on a t-465e with hard parts installed correctly. If you're saying they don't, then well... ok. Doesn't change the fact.

 

[3800sofine]

Barking up the wrong tree if you're trying to iterate that these transmissions are glass. That's well known.

I'm glad you got your fix to work by cutting the wire.

There's no question the value of these cars. People still spend thousands of dollars on a t-465e with hard parts installed correctly. If you're saying they don't, then well... ok. Doesn't change the fact.

that depends what you are comparing the 4t65e to.
have you ever driven a TH300, TH350, TH400 equipped car ?
4t65e's ARE glass. that's a common well known fact, ask any trans repair shop specialist.
that's why they want to go through the entire thing for $3,000, to try to save their reputation.
even then the trans acts up anyway. read some of these threads.
the 3800 in stock form makes a paltry 200HP and that small power blows these 4t65e's to bits.
a girl or grandma driving one back and forth to work can blow up a 4t65e, from just driving it 40mph.
cuz it's filled with clutch mud in no time.
my 455 with tunnel port heads in my 70 Firebird, makes 500HP and over 500 ft. lbs. torque
I had a TH350 rebuilt- ONE TIME- back in 1985,
it cost $150 as a bench job at a local trans shop, I pulled the trans and took it in,
and put in a B&M Transpak when I got it back.
it's still in the car, holding up to this day. currently with a 9", 4000 rpm flash converter.
I've had 4 different engines in front of it, in the past 32 years.
will any 4t65e last that long, behind that kind of power ?
did you ever see the insides of a TH400 ? it's even stronger than the TH350
the only electrical connection on the TH series trans, is the downshift solenoid on some of them. or the switch pitch on the Buicks.
all the shifting is done by means of mechanical governor with weights/springs, and a vacuum modulator, both are changeable from OUTSIDE the trans.
the modulator is held on by ONE bolt, the governor by ONE snap ring.
they are friggin' bulletproof. the governors never go bad, and it may need one modulator in 50 years.
if your idea of a strong trans is a 4t65e, you need to look some stuff up, kid...
the old GM transmissions handled over 2x the power of a 4t65e, and didn't have all these lame-aszed solenoids that clog up with clutch dust
and no stupid clutch in the converter either.
did you ever look inside the bellhousing of a high mileage manual trans car, during a clutch job ?
all that clutch dust in there, stays INSIDE a 4t65e, and ends up in the valve body and solenoids.
not a good idea or design.
what's more demanding on a trans, a 500HP motor, or 200HP motor ?
the 3800 w/4t65e is a commuter mileage car, keep that in mind.
it's not a musclecar.
for the cost of your 4t65e, I bought complete GTO and a Firebird cars, running. with money left over.
the GTO was $600, and the Firebird was $1200
now they are worth 10-20x what I paid for them.
how can you justify paying $3000 for a trans rebuild, that is worth almost nothing next year,
and is a limp-wristed trans that breaks constantly ??
now- if the 3800 had a stick/manual trans behind it, then we'd be cookin' with gas
peruse the 3800 message boards, they are filled with threads of broken, hard shifting 4t65e's, with stuck TCC's
it's a POS trans. very fragile indeed. the hard parts are pretty strong for what it is, but the valve body/control circuits are a joke.
and that converter clutch system, is a disaster. magnets in the pan to catch the dust ? yeh- that's really HD stuff, high tech...
what cracks me up is, the GM bulletin states, if one magnet doesn't catch all the dust in a 4t65e, the fix is put a 2nd magnet in the pan.
that is really laughable...

let me reiterate something here- the TCC in the 4t65e doesn't just engage and stay locked...
it cycles on a duty cycle, meaning it hits on/off constantly to give an average engagement time
just like if you were driving a stick shift car, and riding the clutch constantly, what would happen to the clutch ??
it would wear out quicker.
or to make it even more clear- like using a hand grinder on a piece of steel- hitting it and backing off, and hitting it again and backing off.
once you understand how that TCC works, then all the problems with the 4t65e suddenly makes sense.
it's a totally compromised sacrificial setup just to get 30mph highway, and 22mph city.
they attain that mileage standard, at a cost- clutch material buildup in the trans.