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Nitrous Guys Step In!!

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TDCRacing

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I have been wanting to go with a nitrous setup for a while now...but i don't want to go into it blindly causing something bad to happen....Yep you guessed what comes next. Questions



Is Zex the only kit availabe to us?

I know a 75 shot is not a whole lot but how will a healthy motor hold up to this occasional use at the track?

What gains have been seen 1/4 mile time wise with the edition of a 75 shot?If you really wanted to be helpfull you could guess using my mods in my sig.

What needs to be done to prepare the motor for the nitrous tuning wise? I know it's not ideal to reduce timing but give me some help on this.

Is there a pulley size i shouldnt go under when using this?


Thanks fellas
 


Zex is not the only one. NX, N.O.S., any WET nitrous kit will work. just make sure you get the correct jets.

everyone just sells the Zex kits becuase they are a good kit for a beginner, and everything is all in one little box.

a 75 wont hurt anything. you could spray more than that up to 125....with a healthy motor for a while. once you get above 100...you might want to start retarding the timing....the more you spray...the more timing you want to take out.

I have a 150..I take out 4degrees......

the nitrous will cool the incoming air into the blower as well..so this will help out A LOT!!

I can see .5sec drop....
 
I heard of a couple of guys that had to put forged pistons because the burned holes in the tops of the pistons. I don't know how they had there kits set up or what size they were running, but said it was because GM shaved the tops of the GT pistons to lower compression for the GTP. Any truth to this? They said it happened in about 6 months of using the kit.
 
BADAZGTP said:
but said it was because GM shaved the tops of the GT pistons to lower compression for the GTP. .
Click to expand...


Thats the problem...the stock gt pistons are hypertunic (sp?) the gtp's are already forged....running any kind of power adder on non-forged pistons can couse this...especially nos
 
UR LOSN said:
Zex is not the only one. NX, N.O.S., any WET nitrous kit will work. just make sure you get the correct jets.

everyone just sells the Zex kits becuase they are a good kit for a beginner, and everything is all in one little box.

a 75 wont hurt anything. you could spray more than that up to 125....with a healthy motor for a while. once you get above 100...you might want to start retarding the timing....the more you spray...the more timing you want to take out.

I have a 150..I take out 4degrees......

the nitrous will cool the incoming air into the blower as well..so this will help out A LOT!!

I can see .5sec drop....
Click to expand...



What would you recomend for a beginer but fast learner as far as what kit to buy?


And when you said .5 sec drop. can you be a little more specific on your guestamate?...what size were you talking about?


If i wanted a bigger shot and went with the zex....could i buy a nozzel that was bigger than a 75 that would work with that kit?


As far as the maf tuning goes I think i have gotten it as close as im gunna get it...Next on my list of mods is a afx wideband
 


And how does a 75-100 shot feel when it is activated? Heard any amount was pretty cool feeling....just wondering....
 
TDCRacing said:
Thats the problem...the stock gt pistons are hypertunic (sp?) the gtp's are already forged....running any kind of power adder on non-forged pistons can couse this...especially nos
Click to expand...

So let me see if i got this right. Our GTP's already come with forged pistons? So is it a waste of money to buy aftermarket forged pistons? Or is there a difference? I haven't gotten into doing any piston research yet, so I don't know anything of the factory or aftermarket pistons.
 
Correct. The GTP's already have forged pistons because they come from the factory with a supercharger. im sure the aftermarket ones may be a little bit stronger but the main reason some one would get aftermarket pistons would be to change the compresion ratio.
 
Would stock timing tables be all i could use with nitrous? and then if the shot was big enough i would have to retard the stock timing to lower than stock?
 
TDCRacing said:
Correct. The GTP's already have forged pistons because they come from the factory with a supercharger. im sure the aftermarket ones may be a little bit stronger but the main reason some one would get aftermarket pistons would be to change the compresion ratio.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. Ilearned something new today. I was always told that the GTP had the same piston as the GT, just shaved down. Glad I know what is accually going on inside my motor. Thanks again.
 


Yup no problem, People are running around 13-18 psi on the stock s/c setup (wich is probably around a 2.8) on stock pistons and stock head gaskets easy...That would not happen on non- forged pistons. They would proabably just shatter lol


matter of fact i dont know of any cars that were s/c that didnt come with forged pistons. I know for a fact the 87-93 mustangs came with forged pistons (even the 86 svo 4cyl turbo charged) and i know the newer svt cobra's with the roots style s/c like we have also came with forged pistons...
 
Last edited:
SWEET!!! Have you seen the twin charged configuration Stattama Turbo Kit? Been thinking really hard of maybe running it, but haven't heard anyone talk about it. I know if I di, I'm going to rebuild my whole motor. Due to high miles and to be on the safe side. Do you think the bottom end would need to be beefed up to handle the way more pony's? I want to try and figure what my HP is going to be, cause I don't want to make the OL' Girl non-streetable. There would be some other mods that I would add to it, like a ported s/c housing, bigger throtle body, cam, rockers, s/c intercooler, and maybe a machined intake. Whar's your thoughts? Forgot to ask you, did you make it to the track Friday night? If so, howed she do? You said you had a new setup right?
 
as far as a twin turbo setup on a stock bottom end? probably not gunna last long at all depending on the boost levels...I belive ''urlosin'' has a twin turbo setup...or maybe it is just a single.


As far as the mods that you mentioned....Forget the machined intake...i just ran a breather in the front valve cover because of the intercooler setup...sounds like your on the right track with the mods you've got in mind. I wanted to be a little different...So my goal is to go the fastest i can on a stock heads and cam setup. I really dont want to mess with changing a cam out right now...so when i'm maxing out with the stock heads and cam setup and if one day i do decide to change the cam out it will give me a real nice jump in power.


Get some exhaust first...headers...if you get pacesetters pm me first. It will give a power increase that you can feel for sure over stock...wich will satisfy you...but more importantly it will make room for other mods in the future.Then do the other mods.


As far as going to the track...yes i did make it. My new setup is im my sig and my old setup was only a p-log and fwi and got me a 14.4.

heres my excuses...Tune could have been better for sure,garbage ass street tires and a tranny that is now slipping on the 1-2 shift netted me a 13.5....but hey i whooped all of the imports that were out ther except a eclips that was running 12's and an evo that did a 13.00....even beat the gto's except one that had exhaust and did a 13.4....so i was happy i guess....


What im gunna do next is either smaller pulley or nos...i will probably go with the smaller pulley at first...get my wideband get the nos then port my stock heads....With a real good tune i could go to a 2.8 with bigger injectors ect....but lower than that the stock cam would definetly be holding me back...like i said i am going to do the best anyone can with stock cam and stock ported heads...then see if i want to mess with a cam....that will be the last thing i do though...I would probably get a new tranny first though.

With the nos and a smaller pulley and a real good tune with a w/b i should be around 12.6 i would think for sure
 
Neither GT's or GTP's come with forged pistons... it'd be awesome, but the only difference between the two types are bowl depth and connecting rod length for compression difference. Dropping from 9.4:1 to 8.5:1 was GM's only bottom-end change to fend off trouble.

If they were forged, alot of replaced engines wouldn't have been bought over the years due to issues like these...

40d54c2f9968d6cd54b0c59bdad3809b.jpg


2318fad4.jpg


And here's what a forged piston looks like when it fails...

num5piston.jpg


melted_piston.jpg


The top doesn't fail like our stock ones do, it takes an extreme amount of leaning out to cause the failure, unlike the failures that even a moderately knocking 3.4" pulley setup can do to a stock motor.

Our connecting rods did improve with the Series 3 introduction, though. That's a proven fact that I've inspected myself on multiple builds (all '04+ supercharged cars, even Series 2's... and then they did it for all '05+ N/A 3800's).

On the topic of nitrous though, I'll be reading more from those doing it, since a local guy will be swapping his setup from the L36 he had, to the L67 he now runs. A handful of locals are thinking about it in the distant future, including myself on my forged RWD setup, so I'll be paying close attention to the tuning results.

- Dave
 


Thanks for the info on the pistons. From the looks of the pictures, the tops of the forged pistons seem to be thicker than the stockers.
 
They are, the Diamonds are about 2-3x thicker up there, by design.

I noticed you asked about the Stattama things as well. Their twin-charge kit isn't too popular because people are able to avoid any lag by using the properly sized turbo's that come with the kits. The twin-charged setup was mainly done so that ZZP/Stattama could gain a headstart into the 9sec range a couple years ago in Zoomer's car, before their twin turbo car was ready & before the wealth of knowledge about getting fast launches from turbo cars grew (torque convertor setups, boost adjustments, etc).

They actually ran a stock block in their 9sec car for a long time, but it also chipped pistons when a brief lean-out issue occurred. Not sure if they went forged or with another stocker after that, but either way, it's one of three 3800 cars in the 8's now.

- Dave
 
Damn...my bad for passing on info that was inacurate...i feel like a dumb ass lol...i knew of the different compression ratio between the n/a and s/c models but i could have sworn that i was reading an article that said they were forged...I guess i may have read it wrong....any way sorry about that
 
So what would your recomendations be if it was you, stay with the s/c or got to the turbo side of the house? Or can I get about the same results out of both. I know the turbo doesn't take from the motor because it uses the exhaust, but by running the smaller pulleys on the s/c, with supporting mods of course, get about the same.
 
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