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Here's my question..



Its not like this engine was designed to put out 300 horse and they tamed it down with a tune or a cam or exhaust or intake. This was the best they could do for the dollar.
 
nicksilvergt99 said:
I get it now, your all saying that Pontiac used pretty effective parts for this car already..I see
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Not really. They could have at least used aluminum heads and had a higher compression ratio all around and squeezed some more power out of it that way.

They could have done a whole bunch of optimizations and got a fair bit more power but it would have cost many times more than what they were willing to pay.
 


They honestly could have made it entirely aluminum...but wit hthe way these cars overheat...wouldn't even want to try it. Ever see the Turbo GP they ran in the pinks race? Got a little too hot and warped the head...blew out the gasket and took a chunk of aluminum with it.
 
what is wrong with the design?? it can handle plenty of power. throw some mods at it and tune it.


i think the stock tune is the biggest hender of these cars as well as most cars.
 
blowfishRus6 said:
what is wrong with the design?? it can handle plenty of power. throw some mods at it and tune it.


i think the stock tune is the biggest hender of these cars as well as most cars.
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Well first thing, this isn't like a small block chevy where you slap on new heads, intake, carb and cam and you've gone from 200 horse to 400+.

The bore of 3.8" also restricts the size of the valves that can be used since this is an OHV which limits you to two valves per cylinder.

Blue noted the cooling isn't sufficient to support aluminum heads in racing applications. You'd have to redesign the entire thing to change that.

Handling and generating power are two different things. This engine is one that can handle, not generate. In other words, needs boost.
 
does not matter how you make power, power is power.

if you do it with boost, okay, thats fine.

zzp has the 8 sec gt turbo on the stock bottom end and aluminum heads. you do not have to redesign the whole motor for better cooling. simple open up a few coolent holes that are small from the factory.

and why do you need more than 2 valve per cylender?? lsx motors prove you dont.

there is cam, heads set ups that are making decent power. enough to propell the family sedan into the 11's which aint easy in the first place. but you are comparing a small block chevy, 350 cause we know a 305 wont produce those numbers to a 231. not really fair.

agian power is power, you gonna ***** about how you make it????



for a family sedan and a 231 i think it does pretty damn well. what are some other cars doing better in a four door with a v6 thru an auto trans?
 


Formula one proves OHC to be a better design than OHV.

Just not a realistic one considering 20K RPM redlines are a little stupid. :D

Also simple logic as well. If there are less components, there is less chance of failure and less parasitic loss.

How is it not fair to compare those two motors?

Look at the Honda K20A, producing 260 HP in the Mugen concept car. Isn't that only 132 cu in yet has more power than the supercharged series II with 231 cu in of displacement?

A 305 can put down 330 HP with a top end kit. Not too shabby if you ask me. You get better performance outta the 350's because of the larger bore hence more displacement, larger valves and more aftermarket support. The key to power is moving the piston which means moving air. Move more air, push more power.
 
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but yet has no damn torque and that motor is expense as hell.


you are saying why dont our motors, 231, produce the same numbers with h/c/i as a 350. simpley a 350 has more bore/stroke displacement cylenders to work with. apples to oranges. not fair at all.
 
quite simpley. motors are built diffrent, with diffrent charistics.

the 231 was never built from the factory to be a crazy all out hp maker. it was made to be efficent. which it is. you can go and build a 231 that can be pretty beasty. but that was not there purpose from the factory. cheap and effictive was there goal. and they reached it. but at the same time its pretty durable.


boost it and make some power and have fun..
 
This thread is basically "why doesnt this car make mad power with a $3 mod?" and you just answered it by arguing with me. :D

Its cheap, does its job, can handle boost (sometimes... chipped pistons can be fun) what else do you want from it?
 
how?? what car does make power with a 3 dollar mod??? not many.


again, what v6 dating back to 97 is out doing it???? i know there is some, but the gm 231 does pretty damn good.
 


if you have acess to a tuner and can tune, there is a lot of power to be unleashed for free......

stock tunes are conservitive.
 
either way, you gotta pay to play. bottom line.

gm 231 holds its own for price and power given what it is.

argue that all you want.
 
Its a figure of speech. Also, do you think in spurts? If no one else posts after you, just click edit, saves space. :P

Nissan Skyline - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1997, 280 vs 240.

Nissan Maxima - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

95, 190 vs 195 with 0.8L less displacement

This engine is right where it should be considering its age and the technology involved.

We're arguing the same point. I realize what the engine is, and what it can and can't do. I also realize how you can make power with it as well.

The whole point of this thread is:

either way, you gotta pay to play. bottom line.
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That is, unless your car is so completely restricted from the factory that it just needs to be unlocked with a tune. (And I mean capable of 300 horse yet limited to 200.) Typically cars like that are intercooled with boost. Gm took the liberty of saving money and not installing an intercooler. Hence needing one if you're looking to make big power.
 
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