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Engine seized?

I am confused. How did you go from a car not starting to change the starter= Buy a new motor? Not trying to be mean, but just trying to save you some money. There are so many things to check before I would just junk it. Plugs could be bad is the first thing, coil packs, plug wires, burning rubber could also have been your harmonic balancer since there is rubber in that also. From what you described I would honestly take the harmonic balancer off and check that also. You are going to need a impact most likely and rent the puller from an auto part store. I would start with your ignition system first though. Who knows that rubber smell could have been you burning through a plug wire.
 
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Not trying to discredit or question things 4dr...but I've yet to see one of these factory HG's go in a few hundred of these engines. They are much more rare than a LIM..

However.. has this been confirmed to have coolant in the cylinders? It looked like that was suggested and never comfirmed by the OP.

OP says he has a supercharged car, yet he says "the belt looks good". Uh..there's supposed to be two. Do you see the second belt? I've seen pullies etc go bad and the second belt wrap around the HB etc and cause a near lockup condition due to binding. The smell of rubber and sounds described would be typical of a bad pulley and belt shredding.

Like I mentioned, no disrepect etc.. Just wondering if we've fully diagnosed the car yet.
 
pure2sin.

If you would read closer the engine won't turn over! this has f all to do with an ignition problem at this point! as for the harmonic balancer and the burning rubber smell???? I realize there is rubber here but in what plausible scenario would this cause the motor to lock up!????? (other than billboost37's possible scenario which could happen but the op should have noticed something happening and he said it was running fine before the shutdown)

Billboost37

Yes the op needs to confirm that the engine is infact locked due to coolant. If you read back you will notice that I have told him to remove the belt/s and try that and if that fails then try the removal of the plugs and look for coolant. If there is coolant coming out than I would lean more to a head gasket.... The reason for this being that if the lim gasket was to fail and cause this condition, both the sealing surface around the coolant port and the sealing surface around the intake runner would have to fail to cause this condition. however if the head gasket or head fails it is a direct shot into the combustion chamber. If there was only coolant in the oil than I would say yes it is most likely the lim gasket.

Not trying to be a dick but just pointing out that if the op takes the steps we discussed he will have a pretty good idea of what is going on
 
The op said that the engine turns back just fine but will not turn forwards. Another possible reason that it would NOT be likely that it is infact a seized or wrecked accessory/belt issue. IF and that is only an IF the cyclinder is filled with coolant turning the engine backwards will continue to push the coolant out the intake valve and the coolant will sit in the intake until the rotations brings it back to opening the intake valve again. by doing this the coolant never has a chance of going out the exhaust valve.

4 strokes on and internal combustion engine say so..... intake/compression/power/exhaust strokes. if the cylinder is full and locking the engine must have been on compression stroke as that is the only time it (the piston) is moving upward and both valves are closed. now if the op spins it backwards from this point he instead reaches intake stroke first in which the coolant will be pushed into the intake. after this if he keeps rotating backwards he will hit the exhaust stroke and the cylinder will not have enough coolant to lock the engine because it is sitting in the intake. next he rotates it around for the power stroke and the piston is traveling down so no issues here. and then compression but again since there is no coolant in the cylinder there is no problem. then comes intake again and valve opens causing coolant to rush into the cylinder but since the valve remains open as the piston is traveling upwards the coolant just pushes back into the intake!
 
The rubber and mention of one belt got caught in my diagnosis detector, frequently it's got a good reason for going off. :th_thumbsup-wink:

Fast4.. Like I said, I'm not questioning you, however due to my own experiences with these motors, a head gasket is bout the last place I'm going to look for coolant in the cylinders. Starting at the most common items I've seen that can go wrong and fill a motor, here's how I'd go at looking for a potential coolant leak.

1. Confirm there is coolant in cylinders
2. Pull air intake tube look for coolant in the TB. Typical TB gasket internal leak.
3. Pull charger and look for coolant in the LIM. The o-rings/SC gasket have been known to fail and fill the LIM then cylinders. This will not put coolant in the TB or SC.

If you don't have obvious coolant in those places then you either have a cracked block or bad head gasket. Either of which can be typically fixed (In the US) cheaper with a used motor.
 
Yeah I will agree with you bill but if it was mine and I was in for the lim gasket and this issue I would be doing the heads since I was a few bolts away from doing them
 


My point was that he has not even pulled a spark plug and you guys are talking new motor lol. EDIT-I was wrong about the car needing to be in nutral.
 
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P2S, what's the gear of the trans have to do with it? If the car isn't running, the TC is not stopping the engine from moving.
 
Couldn't this all be checked by a pressure test? I am not trying to be mean here! I am just trying to think of any other options for this guy before he starts trying to pull his motor out.
 
Can't get a compression test done if the motor won't turn.

All he needs to do is pull the plugs on ALL cylinders and see if the motor then turns. If so, then follow what BillBoost said and go from there.

We don't know what this guy's budget is for the repair. So if it turns out to not be a HG, why bother them? Then you have to spend more $$ to buy new HGs, TTY bolts, the proper degree wrench to install said TTY bolts, machine shop charges for the headwork, etc.. I'm all for preventative maint. while I'm down into a motor that far, but I don't typically mess with things that are not known to cause issues.
 
BillBoost37 said:
Fast4.. Like I said, I'm not questioning you, however due to my own experiences with these motors, a head gasket is bout the last place I'm going to look for coolant in the cylinders.
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FordMan77 said:
So if it turns out to not be a HG, why bother them? Then you have to spend more $$ to buy new HGs, TTY bolts, the proper degree wrench to install said TTY bolts, machine shop charges for the headwork, etc.. I'm all for preventative maint. while I'm down into a motor that far, but I don't typically mess with things that are not known to cause issues.
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thank you. that's what i've said since my first post. :th_peaceout:
 
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You guys know the kicker of this thread. OP probably won't post back to us and give us closure.

Dammmit, just like my last 5 girl friends... dammmit dammit dammit (c'mon that's funny)
 
BillBoost37 said:
You guys know the kicker of this thread. OP probably won't post back to us and give us closure.

Dammmit, just like my last 5 girl friends... dammmit dammit dammit (c'mon that's funny)
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Question is, would you really want any of them to come back, lol... If it was screwed up once I'd bet it's still that way :th_laugh-lol2:

And LOL at Reptile.

Personally I think his kanuter valve is screwed up and has a bent thrust plate bearing spinner. Luckily they are available at your nearest Pontiac dealers for replacement. Wait, whaa.. Whadda mean there's no more Pontiac dealers :th_wtf: Well, time to buy a Hyundai and call it a day.
 
Well I guess I will hang up my towel on this discussion. Not about to argue with a bunch of internet cowboys. OP if you still want some advice the offer is still open for pm'ing me
 


seanparker3 said:
I was wondering if my thermostat being stuck open has anything to do with this?
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as its been stated here over and over, remove your spark plugs (20 minute job tops) and crank the engine, if it don't crank its seized, if it does crank, and antifreeze comes out of a cylinder, you will know its hydro locked. ( hydro lock means you have fluid in the cylinder therefore it wont rotate)

and no a bad thermostat wont do anything unless it froze in the closed position and you over heated the engine.
 
I will definitely provide some closure on this once i get it myself haha... and yes I know there are 2 belts they both look good from what i can see under the hood and with the tire and plastic off. Im not going to start doing any engine work until i confirm coolant in the cylinder(s). I know a thing or two but by far am not a mechanic... I just learn things as they come. It just seems to come a lot.. I havent done anything because its too damn cold ... single digits, and i happened to get a good deal on a car at auction. As for my budget I'd like to keep it on the better side of 1k
 
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