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Dyno Results

airflow.....

You have to remember this "crap" I am posting is not just junk I learned from reading crap off the internet... I have been running E85 in 500+whp 3800s for 3 years now.
 


So you're contending that airflow is my limiting factor to 374whp and I will not make any more power by setting the car up for a better fuel?
 
SnowFlake said:
So you're contending that airflow is my limiting factor to 374whp and I will not make any more power by setting the car up for a better fuel?
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Have you discovered anything holding you back with the current blend of ethanol right now? When the blend changes what do you expect to happen?
 
FoSHO99 said:
Have you discovered anything holding you back with the current blend of ethanol right now? When the blend changes what do you expect to happen?
Click to expand...

Smaller pulley and more timing. I really should have been on the 2.6 with the open down pipe. Boost dropped from 14-15psi to 11-12 psi with the exhaust opened up. Non intercooled, the TVS should be run around 14psi and timing around 20* on ethanol. This is a lt of guesswork right now but that seemed to be where the car ran the best.
 
Zef_66 said:
Alright, so I wanted to break this down and see what it would cost to replicate this project. So here is the list of parts and prices that I came up with:

Autolite Spark Plugs AL-104 US $12.00
XPZ Cam Package COMP-XPZ 04-01-01338 with pushrods US $479.99
Valve Spring Retainers 04-01-01157 Modified steel US $44.99
Crow Cams Valve Springs CROW-4918-12 105 lb US $109.99
Siemens Deka 60# Injectors 09-50-001100 Standard EV1 US $249.99
Northstar Throttle Body Kit ZZ-NSTBK-5-MAF Used LQ4 MAF US $299.99
ZZP Subtotal US $1,196.95

Headers and Exhaust Work $200
Supercharger $1500
Adapter Plate $300
Tuning $100
Racetronix Fuel Pump $210

Grand Total : $3510

Now that is a lot in my opinion to get 350whp from stock. Granted some of those parts can be picked up used for cheaper. But if the point of the swap is reliability, then you don't want to go too cheap and too used. Not to mention I listed the TVS SC at $1500, which is way under new price just to please the masses. I didn't include any of the little stuff either, which we all knows adds up quickly. Like his alternator relocation, gaskets, fluids, bolts, etc, etc, etc. Right there you could probably add on another $500 easy. And a one time base tune for $100 that you can't really do any changes. Anyone looking to make the 375whp mark would probably want to get a tuner and do it themselves since E85 octane levels seem to vary so much.

Overall, I think that is an honest look at what it would take cost wise to do this swap on a stock L67 engine (not L32 like the OP), and have it reliable.
Click to expand...


ORIGINAL: Zef_66


Alright, so I wanted to break this down and see what it would cost to replicate this project. So here is the list of parts and prices that I came up with:


Autolite Spark Plugs AL-104 US $12.00
XP Cam Package US $324.99
Valve Spring Retainers 04-01-01157 Modified steel US $44.99
Crow Cams Valve Springs CROW-4918-12 105 lb US $109.99
Siemens Deka 60# Injectors 09-50-001100 Standard EV1 US $249.99
Northstar Throttle Body Kit ZZ-NSTBK-5-MAF Used LQ4 MAF US $299.99
ZZP Subtotal US $1,196.95


Headers and Exhaust Work $200
Supercharger $1500
Adapter Plate $300
Tuning $100
Racetronix Fuel Pump $210


Grand Total : $3355
Click to expand...


Well... Let's just figure it out ourselves. First off, I have an XP, not an XPZ. So I fixed that.


Cost for GenV to make similar power.


Autolite Spark Plugs AL-104 US $12.00
XP Cam Package US $324.99
Siemens Deka 60# Injectors 09-50-001100 Standard EV1 US $249.99
Northstar Throttle Body Kit ZZ-NSTBK-5-MAF Used LQ4 MAF US $299.99
ZZP Intercooler with modded fuel rails (the cheap ones) $1319.99
ZZP Stage 3 heads (comes with springs) $1599.99
ZZP Subtotal US $3807


GenV blower + MPS and pullies - $500
Headers and Exhaust Work $200
Tuning $100
Racetronix Fuel Pump $210


Grand Total: $4817... Nearly $1,500 more.




I didn't include any of the little stuff either, which we all knows adds up quickly. Like gaskets, fluids, bolts, etc, etc, etc. Right there you could probably add on another $500 easy. And a one time base tune for $100 that you can't really do any changes. Anyone looking to make the 375whp mark would probably want to get a tuner and do it themselves since E85 octane levels seem to vary so much.


Another great benefit of the TVS is that you don't need to go any deeper into the engine than the LIM, that's it! You also have the option of doing things like heads/IC ON TOP of doing the TVS for even more power.


IMO, an honest comparison. Right Zef?
 


SnowFlake said:
Smaller pulley and more timing. I really should have been on the 2.6 with the open down pipe. Boost dropped from 14-15psi to 11-12 psi with the exhaust opened up. Non intercooled, the TVS should be run around 14psi and timing around 20* on ethanol. This is a lt of guesswork right now but that seemed to be where the car ran the best.
Click to expand...

But the fuel hasn't limited you thus far on the low blend or have you pushed it enough to tell?
 
C&S is getting a set of my heads soon.

edit because i dont want to make my own post: yup, them. in butler. i would definitely take something to them with zero worries.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I would get knock on the street from time to time. It didn't knock on the dyno though... I really regret not bringing the 2.6. Might have been good for another 15-20whp with tuning.
 
Lulz your cost chart of the heads cam IC gen5 setup look just as retarded compared to a Turbo setup that will stomp BOTH!

Umm pretty much just the IC + Head cost in your breakdown makes going turbo a no brainer!

"disclaimer hope I dont get an infraction or something lol"

Option C turbo kit costs less than 3XXX.00
 


Ya know... I've been going over the dyno scans and there was some funky stuff happening. My ECT sensor kept popping in and out during the runs, sending commanded AFR all over the place. That and the dyno operator didn't take the car past 5700rpm on the last 2 runs. I told him 6500... I made 369whp at 5700rpm on the very last run. The 374 runs both had numbers 15whp under that at 5750 on the graph.

I may have to go back...
 
SnowFlake said:
Well... Let's just figure it out ourselves. First off, I have an XP, not an XPZ. So I fixed that.
Cost for GenV to make similar power.
Autolite Spark Plugs AL-104 US $12.00
XP Cam Package US $324.99
Siemens Deka 60# Injectors 09-50-001100 Standard EV1 US $249.99
Northstar Throttle Body Kit ZZ-NSTBK-5-MAF Used LQ4 MAF US $299.99
ZZP Intercooler with modded fuel rails (the cheap ones) $1319.99
ZZP Stage 3 heads (comes with springs) $1599.99
ZZP Subtotal US $3807

GenV blower + MPS and pullies - $500
Headers and Exhaust Work $200
Tuning $100
Racetronix Fuel Pump $210

Grand Total: $4817... Nearly $1,500 more.

IMO, an honest comparison. Right Zef?
Click to expand...

Hmm, not really now that I have a second to look into it. Since E85 isn't available to everyone, and to make it a fair comparison, I looked at your base number of 350whp. Looking at the HP chart on CGP, there are several of people that made 350whp, or close to it on stock heads. So the ZZP S3 heads are not a necessity to make comparable HP to the TVS.

So this is the price list that I came up with:

Autolite Spark Plugs AL-104 US $12.00
Crow Cams Valve Springs CROW-4918-12 105 lb US $109.99
Siemens Deka 60# Injectors 09-50-001100 Standard EV1 US $249.99
Northstar Throttle Body Kit ZZ-NSTBK-5-MAF Used LQ4 MAF US $299.99
X-P HOT Cam COMP-3312/3324-116+2-XP Modified Retainers US $344.99
Intercooler 08-01-0061708-50-0063609-01-00534 Modified Fuel Rails Bosch pump US $1,319.99
ZZP Subtotal US $2,336.95

GenV blower + MPS and pullies - $500
Headers and Exhaust Work $200
Tuning $100
Racetronix Fuel Pump $210

Grand Total: $3346

Compared to the Updated TVS build:
Autolite Spark Plugs AL-104 US $12.00
X-P HOT Cam COMP-3312/3324-116+2-XP Modified Retainers US $344.99
Crow Cams Valve Springs CROW-4918-12 105 lb US $109.99
Siemens Deka 60# Injectors 09-50-001100 Standard EV1 US $249.99
Northstar Throttle Body Kit ZZ-NSTBK-5-MAF Used LQ4 MAF US $299.99
ZZP Subtotal US $1,016.96

Headers and Exhaust Work $200
Supercharger $1500
Adapter Plate $300
Tuning $100
Racetronix Fuel Pump $210

Grand Total : $3326
Click to expand...

So right about even to get the same amount of power. That is a more honest comparison in my opinion.
 


well zzp claims hooper made 30 WHP more on his VS cam engine with S3 heads.... little do they mention that was on race gas.

So 34x WHP on a VS? not really.

In this sort of situation, you really want proof they were on pump, not vice versa.
 
Zef_66 said:
Proof of that?
Click to expand...

Type their name into the search bar under author and type "Dyno" into the search field. Cross reference their numbers with the corresponding thread they created. I haven't found one person with relevant numbers who was on 93 octane.
 
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