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do i need machined guides for xp cam?

W

WOTFTW

New member
On zzp it says the xp is the largest cam that can be ran on stock heads but they also suggest in the notes to get machined guides and tells stories about bad oil leaks. I plan on getting new lifters, rods, springs and retainers with it. but with the package im getting, it comes with modded retainers(not sure if that makes much of a difference). so my question is for you all who've had experience with the cam... do i need to machine down my guides to reliably run this cam without destroying the retainers?

Any advice is greatly appreciated. Thanks
 


YES!!!!! At a bare minimum Mill down .100. My shop measured the lift, spring compression with the valve guide seal and Milled .150 off mine so the guide seal wouldn't be damaged. Your machine shop can check it and tell you exactly how much. But Again a minimum of .100 off. Also see Safely modding your 3800. The search button is your friend.
 
With a combination of zzp's viton valve seals and modified spring retainers you can run the xp on stock heads
 
search button failed me on this one :(

you said you got them milled an extra .050 for the guides seals... why is that? how is the seal effected by clearance? does it touch the retainer if there isn't enough? sorry, I'm learning as i go :D
 
Yeah they give you shorter seals so the retainer wont hit them. If you are going to mill the guide go .1"
 


Look at it this way. The bigger the lift if the cam, the more the valve opens. ie: the more the valve spring is compressed. If the spring compresses to where the Valve guide seal gets crushed between the valve guide and the spring retainer, then you will have bad valve guide seals. I used the Viton valve guide seals. And .100 means 100 thousandths of an inch. .150 is 150 thousandths of an inch. You can use Mics, depth Mics height gage or even calipers.
 


99prixgt said:
so if you used zzp's modified spring retainers couldn't you avoid milling the guides?
Click to expand...

that's what i was thinking. I mean... that would be the purpose of modding them in the first place. Has anyone had retainers go bad or heard of someones go bad while using the xp? If so... what was the set-up?

Only reason I'm pushing this is because zzp advertises it as if you can just throw it in and go. And I want the biggest cam possible while pushing good reliability. I'm willing to mill down the guides if need be but I don't want to if it is not necessary.
 
ROLF...

The purpose of the XP and or S1X camshafts are to be run on stock heads w/o having to pull the heads and have them worked.

The way to run these two cams is to replace the valve seals with the viton seals (I think it's a fel pro seal BTW) and then run a modded retainer. ZZP's retainers give a bit more clearance than Intense's but Intense's don't cause issues on an XP setup if the seals are changed.

You don't technically need lifters, rockers or pushrods when swapping a cam. Just a little FYI in case you want to save some money for other stuff down the road.
 
Well I blew a piston so it's already a full rebuild. Cam was shot, lifters too. So I'm just replacing the bulk of the valve train while it's torn apart. I'm looking at keeping this car for possibly another 100k if possible while i go to college so I'm lookin for maximum reliability but I still want a good kick behind the pedal :th_thumbsup-wink:
 


only reason I'm camming it is because... i have to replace the cam anyway so I figured I'd go ahead and get a performance cam instead of an oem replacement. And if i did that then I could spend about an extra 75-100 bucks for almost the same lift I'd get with 1.9 rockers, while the rockers are about 300. if i also got rockers with the cam, I'd rather just go buy some new heads all together(Not trying to get too crazy).

Cost isn't too much of an issue but I'm really trying to keep the build under control lol. Trying to keep it under $2500.
Rebuild kit-550
Pistons-350ish
Block work(cleaned and bored .030 over)- 350
Cam+springs+retainers-about 500-550
lifters and rods- 250ish
SD headers- 220
plus the little stuff and that's already 2250 there
 
Then, you decide you want to have your supercharger ported and intake done. You want to get some better air flow in this hog, so you decide to get a northstar tb or ls1 setup. Haha, I've been there. I started w/ a thousand dollar upgrade budget. I'm well past that. I figured I would do it right this time though. I'm even going to upgrade the trans. this time.
 
To be honest WOTFTW, you'd probably be better off getting another motor, and going from there.

I've been pricing around, on which would be cheaper to do. Get my block worked (blew 3 pistons, blocks good tho) and rebuild it. Then use all the existing part, but like you, I'd need lifters, and a cam too.

After the price of boring the cyls, align boring the block, and having it hot tanked, and decked, plus the cost of new bearings, pistons, and rings, it's just not worth it to me.

So I shopped around for a few weeks, and found an awesome L26 for $275.
So, that alone dropped over $700 that'd I have to spend to get mine rebuilt.

Plus, from what I've read, if not done absolutely spot on, they like to spin a bearing after very few miles.

Just a thought, since Im going through the same thing
 
NineD9GT said:
Then, you decide you want to have your supercharger ported and intake done. You want to get some better air flow in this hog, so you decide to get a northstar tb or ls1 setup. Haha, I've been there. I started w/ a thousand dollar upgrade budget. I'm well past that. I figured I would do it right this time though. I'm even going to upgrade the trans. this time.
Click to expand...

lol I'm a prime example of that. This build was originally take my good motor in my gtp and simply drop it in a nicer body. Somehow it turns into this mess:confused:

machine... WTF ARE YOU DOING TO BLOW 3 PISTONS MAN. lol thats nut. But i commend you for that as well. I was actually considering buying a new engine but this is also a learning experience for me. I'm only 18 and a year ago I didnt know jack shet about cars. This project actually started christmas break of 09. I been doing loads of research with guidance from my dad to do this build right since then(not too easy to rebuild a car when you dont even know what a crank is. who would've thought?). But now I'm knowledgeable enough to be my neighborhood's mechanic :th_thumbsup-wink: and after the countless hours spent reading, I hope to have this build done within a couple months

whew... life story
 
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