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2000 GTP: Still Alive! New Trans?

Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

Driver side is a bit more depressing. I can see a little rust on the inner rocker, but I think (hope) it's still good enough. Nothing like the outer, of course. Pics of that side...
Ever wonder why they rust? LOL

Front before I poked it all in...

Inner rocker...

Rear...



I can't wait for some expert opinions, lol.
 


Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

80180 must be 80 grit and 180 grit, unless its a part number. I like to prep metal for epoxy with 40 then 80 after the strippin wheel.

The car isn't ate up too bad, nice!

There ought to be enough scraps of clean metal from the old rockers, to make that patch at the dogleg area of the quarter. If you can do bendy things, I bet you can. It would be nice to weld those in but it IS a rocker jamb after all. You could bond in a rough patch and mud it in. With all the work you have in that ride, yep this is about as far as that rust needs to get. Inner rockers can be freaky clean next to toasty outers, its just a primer application issue. A robot thin spot. At least GPs weren't bad peelers!
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

Is this about as bad as you expected? Short of those dog legs (your term? lol) nothing else special is needed? Good news about that dog leg is a lot of it is covered by the side skirt, so it doesn't have to be THAT pretty, just fixed. Is there a drain or something along those lined I should put in? I was thinking of drill holes in the bottom of the skirt so I could rinse it out ever so often.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

Frankly I expected a little worse. Bill's Regal probably needs the tall rocker. But as you see the poke test is when you do the real finding out what ya got. I'm with you on some drains. It would make sense to notch the bottom flange and put a row of holes in the molding. But that also lets dust ascend into the cavity. Wonder what happens if you just seal the whole thing off from weather. probably not possible. Relocating the front sunroof drains, if so equipped, might put a little less water on top of the molding. Another good thing about the quarter jamb is that if its solid enough to not poke thru, thats OK to convert and then fill the pits.

This project ain't gonna be so bad, just new ground for a guy who can already fix things. What we live for.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

Exactly, I just want to make sure I do it right since it's uncharted territory. That rear dog leg won't pass the poke test, especially the driver side. It's solid before the top of the side skirt though, so I can patch below it and it won't be seen at all...hopefully, lol. I love new challenges.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

I was wondering, should I just put the slip on rocker panel on over everything, trace it, then just cut 1 inch smaller all around? That'd make for a pretty big hole and would be easier to brush that (I assume I'm brushing it on?) epoxy on. Bad idea?


Oh and a side project\goal for my dad and I. The car will have no incandescent lights bulbs in it at all. I have the easy stuff on the way, we'll be doing the window switches, climate control, and DIC at a later date (after rust). He comes down to hang out with the kids and family every so often so it's nice to have a little project with him.
 


Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

I'm guilty of throwing a lot of info at you at once. Re-read post #808, we're on the same page. I'd trim off the sill plate areas that stick up unless you need it somewhere. Maybe I'm reading the part's picture wrong. It would help if we was standing by the car with the part, wouldn't it? As usual I can get money, time, or car for going out of town... just not all 3 at once ha ha. Trim where you like, once the job is all right there in front of you. If you find yourself unable to decide something like that during the fix day, I'll probably be here with an idea. Use the scraps to make your patches.

For real- I'm not familiar with this what they call slip-on rocker. Crashed late models get repair pieces cut from new OE unisides or salvage cars. It must be intended to overlap, which is OK as long as it clears the doors n moldings. If not, a stepped flange would be needed for bonding, or backing plates on butted seams. Other guys might trap rust under the new panel. You're gonna have a solid fix if you can pull it off neatly. Nice feather in cap that nobody ever sees but you'll like your car better somehow. If you don't have hail / tornado type ins coverage, I'd consider it after adding that much value back to the car.

Now don't forget the cavity wax... nor to go wild on the rest of the structure with it, like rails and such. Nobody usually cares enough to but you're fixing your own so you can! I digress, its optional. Just a bonus I like to see and it works.

idrivejunk said:
The idea in my mind is to cut out everything except the last 1/2 -3/4" of what isn't covered by the replacement panel... once the part you don't want to use is trimmed away. Like that sill area, don't think you'll need that. No sense having an extra layer afterwards except for the bond flange so just trim the new part, lay it on the old and outline it with a sharpie then chop an inch in from there to start. Having part in hand is necessary to nail the procedure down past that.

I fit patches so they butt, and weld them. Its truly overkill here. Your upper seam is gonna end up being the skyward-facing horizontal flat strip between the outermost edge of the rocker, and where it goes vertical. A guy could put a row of plug welds there instead of a butt weld but bonding will just be a one layer overlap with maybe a seam sealer or adhesive wipe around the edge before paint. Much less mess.
Click to expand...
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

Yeah..Mine is bad enough that you aren't lifting the car from the drip edge at the moment. While I'd love to do it myself, I may just have a local do it as he seems to do quality work for a good price.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

Wow, that's pretty bad, lol. I knew I got the idea from somewhere IDJ, lol. I'll have to go back and read through the part with the wax. If it'll make it last longer and isn't all the expensive, I'm doing it.

I just got the car realigned and he said he straighten the wheel a bit and adjusted some toe on the rear passenger. Camber on the rear driver is at -1.3, dancing with -1.4, but that's it. He's saying the only other thing it could be is the camber. Caster seemed way off, too. Driver front was 3.9 and passenger was 3.6. His machine said the limit was 3.0, it's not adjustable, so wtf? I haven't driven it on a level road yet, they're rare around here...lol.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

Booba5185 said:
I knew I got the idea from somewhere IDJ, lol.
Click to expand...

Hey man... I know I'm kinda blowin up the thread with rocker stuff while you're in the midst of chasing wheel alignment. I had an idea so I gotta spew it but on the suspension subject I'll say: If the proper adjustment is not within range of the parts, modify the parts or body / frame until it is. Theres no rules and its your car, just be safe. These and all the other unibody cars have a great deal of precision in the dimensions of the structure itself. But the suspension is kinda approximate, if you will. Don't get terribly caught up in being .2 out of spec on a rear, for example.

The only cars with perfectly straight steering wheels haven't been touched or got a little lucky. If you start splitting hairs, you might pull out every last one. Do she drive straight and not scrub tires? Thats all ya need. I have to go way far from home to find a road where its even possible to truly evaluate the car. FWD will never let you take your hands off the wheel and keep straight like RWD stuff does.


On to my revelation, as it often happens on days off I found a moment for some quiet reflection shortly after four. Sat on the patio staring at the 72GP. After a hoarde of other subjects flowed through, your rockers came up. I considered how you jumped right on the bond vs weld option and my left brain jumped in. Alternate attachment methods flashed by. It occurred to me that theres no reason you couldn't have a removeable rocker / molding assembly that could be cleaned out each spring if you like. I followed the thought and while not looking at a sedan rocker at that moment, I thought hey screws... no, rivets... wait how about clips? Oh I know- tabs and slots on the top edge, clips at the bottom or whatever you want.

Consider it a seed thrown on your dirt, if it grows so be it. Never know if these ideas are any good until I dump em on somebody, y'know? Happens a lot at work, lots of fun to be free to express car mod ideas. I can draw a picture if you can't imagine it too. The only "invisible repair" option is a fullblown butt welded and bondoed deal. So no matter what, when you open the door the fact that work has been done down there will be obvious. Tabs would be clean, man. Maybe....
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

That is a good idea, I could even to rivets if I wanted to, it'd nothing to drill them out and all that. Go ahead and draw a picture if you don't mind, you are the expert, and if I want to build on something I'd want it to be off of your idea. You've been in this crap 10000x more than I have, so you can see the potential for things to go wrong.

I also found out today that I'm off Thursday and Friday. I might try and get my strut tower repaired in that time, I have a buddy that can weld and i have a stick welder...I just gotta look up the details on keeping the camber good enough after the repair and such.
 


Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

Heres the general idea. If the row of resistance welds on the bottom vertical flange of the existing outer / inner rocker is clean enough to use, you could join your new part on the ground-facing horizontal flat thats hidden by the molding. That would keep original appearance during a peek under the car. Just another bonus junk-ism. It doesn't hurt as bad to draw as it does write or type. Left-only typin is sllloooow.

IMG_6038_zpsjn8lezr9.jpg
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

I think I get it, it'd almost serve as a hinge, right? There would only be maybe 3 or 4 tabs per door, right? I just wanna make sure we're on the same page.

Strut towers are a go for this weekend, I'm happy about it. It'll cost me about $20 so far.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

Righto, and sweet on the tower fix. 3 or 4 tabs at each sill, yep. Something like that, whatever seems sturdy. They could be small and many or large and few but too large and strength might be an issue. A rivet or two somewhere would keep it from rattling around and you could pad the tabs with plastidip if that was an issue. Might have to unbolt a door or two to swing it in. But yeah this would kinda look like a hinge. Unless you put a bead of sealer on the ooutside of the seam. Hell we're one stap away from double sided taping it on ha ha. Hey that... naaaw. Well... anyway yeah the tabs could be different or just skipped at the B-pillar. Maybe fasteners there, whatever suits you at the time. Just keep the water runoff path in mind and seal everything.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, 3.6, ...KR.

We have narrowed down the location of the mason/dixon rust line just now. Arkansas cars have no rust, Missourri cars have light rust, and Illinois has lots of rust
 


Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

should make a map for which cars to stay away from, be a cool map!
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

^^^Lol. I miss Phoenix for that reason. My truck was bought brand new by my grandpa when I was 4, and when I drove here is was 100% rust free. Literally. Now it had a little, but it's mostly surface rust and that kind of thing.

I got the center caps done and installed, it's time to find some BUDGET lug nuts. I'm thinking black to match the whole theme, but I want something that will last awhile. I'm hoping to find some for less than $50, and have a lock. Anyone have an idea?

LEDs for everything are on the way, don't have a delivery date though. The goal is to loose all incandescent bulbs. My dad is already getting the stuff to change the window switches, DIC, climate control, all that stuff. The stuff in the mail is for the cluster, tail lights, license plate, and front head light. Between the retros and all the LEDs I'll be saving 15-20amps at idle, depending on the situation (high beams, blinkers on, etc.). This obviously is a back burner to the rust, my dad comes down every few weeks to hangout with the family and such and it's nice to have little projects he can help out a lot with. Here's the center cap...you can see why I need new lug nuts...stupid small town tire shop.
 
Re: 2000 GTP...Retros, suspension goodies, And RUST!

I wouldn't do it even if you wanted me too. My wife and kids would kill me. They inherited her klutzness, so they'd get impaled.

Plans have changed a bit, there might only be 1 strut tower getting done this weekend, the driver side. That's fine by me for the time being because it'd the rusted one, the passenger doesn't show any signs...but will be patched eventually either way. My original buddy fell through (like everyone else in this damn town!) so I have another buddy that has Mig that will be doing it for me on Friday. He says it'll take all day for one side, I doubt it.

Good news is my neighbors are moving and they have a jungle gym\swing set thing that they are going to give me for the labor of changing their fuel pump on the PT Cruiser. I'm doing that Thursday, strut tower Friday, and helping the buddy doing the welding move on Saturday as payment. Sunday, I don't know yet, lol. Probably some wiring on the window controls for the alarm.
 
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