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Whats the perfect cam?

basshead42

basshead42

New member
I was lookin into getting either an XP cam from ZZP or the thrasher cam. The thrasher has a higher lift. Is that better? Also how do these or any cam effect drivability? Now obviously when i do the cam i"m gona do the double roller timing chain, 105 or the 130 pound springs etc. Now the bigger question is can you put on a different ratio rocker on opposed to the stock 1.6? How does all this work and whats a SWEEEEET combination of parts to get some awesome performance out of your stock heads?
 


thrasher cam? no. dont do it.

what are your goals and how do you want the car to run?

that will explain where your cam selection should be.
 
I still want to be able to drive it daily. Also, ZZP says that with he XP cam you can run a 3" pulley. Whats your take on that? And i want a cam that will give you a sweet grin the first time you take the car outafter the install. Just want to be able to notice a significant difference in performance. Any ideas for a good setup?
 
the thrasher cam sounds hella mean (i ran one), but it is definately not a cam you want to choose if youre looking to go fast.

the XP is a good all around cam that you can run on stock heads and depending upon your exhaust it can sound decently lopey.

an s1x from intense is similar to an XP, but it has a lower powerband so people that have run both say they like the s1x more for a DD.


are you looking to run stock heads or ported ones? are you more into the mean sounding cam or you want it to go retarded fast too? take everything ZZP says with a giant grain of salt. they like to talk up their own products.
 
Yup...ZZP can say what they want...remember they think you get more power with a larger pulley since you are over-revving your Eaton and destroying it :D I got my XP, but just because you have a cam don't mean you can run a 3" Pulley...you'll need injectors for that small of a pulley anyhow...when I was running my 3.1" my injectors started to go static and I run a 3.25" no KR on the daily with 91...I only had .3* of KR at the top of 2nd gear with the 3.1" so I bet if I had access to 93/94 octane and larger injectors I wouldn't doubt I could have ran a 3.0" KR free...but you gotta tune, tune, tune for it...
 
We've got folks around here running all the various daily driver cams (VS, S1x, XP). They are all happy, and I've never had trouble with any of the parts (always a good thing, when you're the only installer/troubleshooter around).

I wouldn't even consider a Thrasher cam for a stock head application. Aside from the clearance up top being questionable even with modded retainers to try helping, the airflow of the added lift isn't going to be utilized properly.

The XP has treated me GREAT for the past 4+yrs and 55k miles. Even with a big blower running on it now, I'm still able to get 30mpg on ocassional road trips. The idle sound is the best "lope" of the 3, for whatever reason that results in. The VS has a smoother sound, but subtle gurgle to hint at being there. The S1x is a bit difficult to get a smoother rumble from, and I've played with various idle rpm's to try (just being picky). If you want vids of each, I can dig them up from my photobucket, or where-ever my buddys save theirs.

Power ends up coming from what else is done to the engine. Headers are almost a must, and that's another discussion for choice. I'd suggest valvetrain upgrades for the XP and S1x, but the VS is meant for stock valvetrain items with lower miles (get a fresh chain/tensioner if you're over 30k). Unless your butt dyno is somehow calibrated, you won't be able to tell the difference in power band without getting a dyno sheet later on. If it goes faster & runs clean, be happy when it's done.

- Dave
 


Well sounds like im gonna go with the XP. With that in mind, do you use stock rockers or do they need changed? And was there a big difference with the XP cam after you guys installed it?
 
Stock everything but valve springs and retainers...and YEAH...its a cam ;) I wish I knew how much difference it really made because I added the XP, Headers, Ported S/C and TB and went from a 3.4" to a 3.2"...so...it was A ****TON faster I'll tell ya that lol
 
another thing to think about also is powerbands. where you want your power at. some cams make good power low, some make good power up high.

if it wasent for zzp's on and off tunning i would suggest the NIC cam. low 12's with cam headers and pulley.

just to give an idea. tdc went 12.7 with a 1.9 60" with an xp cam, fullsize intercooler, race tranny with 3.29 gears, zzp headers, zzp throttle body, 2.8 pulley and whatever else you need to run that.
 
blowfishRus6 said:
another thing to think about also is powerbands. where you want your power at. some cams make good power low, some make good power up high.

if it wasent for zzp's on and off tunning i would suggest the NIC cam. low 12's with cam headers and pulley.

just to give an idea. tdc went 12.7 with a 1.9 60" with an xp cam, fullsize intercooler, race tranny with 3.29 gears, zzp headers, zzp throttle body, 2.8 pulley and whatever else you need to run that.
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True, but I went 12.7 with XP, stock 3.29 tranny, SSAC headers, GenV & Northstar... and power curves depend more on the way the combination works & is tuned. I've seen some fall off like a rock, while others carry to redline better, with cam version not mattering in this equation.

Whichever items you get, it's going to beneft from all the little details you cover. This is how people could squeeze more power back in the day from alot less mods than most folks run today... they'd tune & tune, find little things to improve on the engine/airflow here & there, and gain great experience as they went along.

- Dave
 


did you have the higher comperssion then?? j/w.

tunning is a big aspect to it. that is one of the most critical things you need to look into in this whole process.
 
blowfishRus6 said:
did you have the higher comperssion then?? j/w.

tunning is a big aspect to it. that is one of the most critical things you need to look into in this whole process.
Click to expand...

Yes, was on a 70k '01 L36 block at the time. I ran a 2.9 and 3.0 pulley back then, on partial GT100 mix. Similar to an L67 block with 2.7-2.8.

- Dave
 
blowfishRus6 said:
if it wasent for zzp's on and off tunning i would suggest the NIC cam. low 12's with cam headers and pulley.
Click to expand...

Yea you know, just cam, intake, headers, race gas, weight reduction (a lot), slicks, built trans, god only knows what else is hidden. I get flamed if i leave out the fact that i use E85, so not mentioning race gas which is HUGE in a non i/c'd car is just as bad. They act like the cars just had intake, exhaust, cam, and ran f-ing low 12's... riiiiiiiight.

The NIC is junk, it's a cam meant to give everyone what they want, which is lope. Nobody wants a functional cam, they want a cam that sounds mean. 90% of the nic cars run like crap, and 2-3 ran low 12's non i/c'd. There's plenty of xp and s1x cars that did the same thing, and i bet they get much better gas mileage. The NIC would be cool on a 10.2-10.5:1 compression build with way more lift (so it would have to be a custom grind) on some s3-s4 heads, E85, and a Gen V. That would be a mean sounding and well functioning car.
 
Mikegotone'02 said:
Yea you know, just cam, intake, headers, race gas, weight reduction (a lot), slicks, built trans, god only knows what else is hidden. I get flamed if i leave out the fact that i use E85, so not mentioning race gas which is HUGE in a non i/c'd car is just as bad. They act like the cars just had intake, exhaust, cam, and ran f-ing low 12's... riiiiiiiight.

The NIC is junk, it's a cam meant to give everyone what they want, which is lope. Nobody wants a functional cam, they want a cam that sounds mean. 90% of the nic cars run like crap, and 2-3 ran low 12's non i/c'd. There's plenty of xp and s1x cars that did the same thing, and i bet they get much better gas mileage. The NIC would be cool on a 10.2-10.5:1 compression build with way more lift (so it would have to be a custom grind) on some s3-s4 heads, E85, and a Gen V. That would be a mean sounding and well functioning car.
Click to expand...

i would run a NIC if it wasnt such a small cam. small cams are for girls.
 


By all means they have every right to do that, and in no way shape or form am i going to take that away from them, BUT getting someone's hopes up by saying stuff like that is just mean.
 
they got my hopes up :/

it was a big hype for a little while but i never heard anything else about it. there is probably a reason why...
 
i'm gonna look into some custom grinds for my application, however, from all the research I've done on the XP I get the best of both worlds with that cam. Since I one day have this dream of running some juice my choices were between an XP or s1x or possibly a custom grind. If I don't go custom then the XP wins out for me because I get a nicer idle over the s1x and I'll be more than satisfied with the gains.
 
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