Thread: questions about 3800 heads and which cam to go with.

If you're really worried about having bigger valves, if just go with l32 heads, I can't remember if both the intake and exhaust valves are larger, but I know for a fact it has bigger intake valves. Just get them ported, have the combustion chambers polished up and have the guides machined, have your LIM matched. And run them like that. I think most people just use bigger stemmed, titanium valves. And have the guides machined or press in New bronze guides to match the stem. They also do something with the spring pocket and seat I believe as well to run a different install height spring to accommodate the higher lift. Somebody with more experience chime in and help this guy out. Getting all of this stuff done(Getting it done right) is going to cost a pretty penny, I hope you have deep pockets.

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Easily achievable with nitrous and that setup with a blower.... right?

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So all the people who prefer a supercharger(who cares whatever the reason may be, to each their own) seen high tens, and the very bottom of 11s, on m90s and mp112s or a whipple, while spraying some nitrous, should just go home? And because they didn't take the easy route of just bolting on a turbo and running the same times, makes them a baby? Some people enjoy the challenge, don't mind slowly building their car and spending the extra money, have a passion or love for superchargers and/or nitrous, and because of this... that makes them retarded?

This thread wasn't about asking if he should ditch his dream of building a 400+whp supercharged car and taking the easy route like you did and bolting up a perfect, don't have to have any skill whatsoever, kit from some vendor.

He asked technical questions and wanted to make sure he was on the right track for HIS BUILD, that HE is going to build.

I'm sure he's seen the 80% of your 8000 posts saying turbo or go home and knows that is an option, and he may just not want to go that route. What would you turbo guys have to talk about if you had a turbograndprixforums.net?

"This is how I followed ZZP's color, step by step instructions that was included in my perfectly fabricated kit which can be installed with a Stanley toolset from wal Mart in one night. Then dropped It off at zzp for them to tune. Now I have a fast car.
Man that's exciting....

Anyone who actually knows what they're talking about care to chime in and help this fella get his project underway, that would be much appreciated.

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Originally Posted by ItHurtz

Easy route? If tearing the motor to a short block, putting a cam in, porting heads, all the works, re installing the turbo and its 10' of pipe is easy **** I would hate to see the hard part.

The record is what 425whp? A turbo ****s all over it with way less money and way less engine work. Its not the point that hey you nitrous fck or you m90 pu$$y blah blah blah its common sense. If you or someone wants to spend 10k to be able to beat on the car for 11.9 cool. Its all been done, nothing that gets done in the future is new, its all been tried and if you want to be that special someone who wastes money cool. Whines are cool, until you actually play with a jet. You or the op can do whatever you want, but you will always get **** on for half the price.

I'm not saying I don't like turbo cars because I like both equally I've built several turbo cars over the years and loved them... I just don't see why you turbo guys always jump on every chance you get to say... just get a turbo. When EVERY one on this forum knows that's an option. Everyone knows they are faster. Everyone knows it can be done cheaper... But yet most still stick with the m90. Is it probably the wrong decision for people who are going for the record setting grand prix 1/4 mile time....yes. But some people just want to see how far they can take it. Some people just have money to blow like that.

Plain and simple. This guy asked a few questions about head work for an xpz cam setup. And to maybe make some contacts for resourcing this information. And you come here to say just get a turbo. How many times do you think that exact statement has been posted here? Mainly how many times has it been posted when the thread starter wasn't in any way shape or form asking... should I go turbo, or should I stick with the m90? I feel you guys do it to indirectly brag that your car is faster than mine. We all know this... a d dont care. We all build our cars for our own enjoyment, not to be judged by others upon how we do so.

You guys saw a chance to say go turbo before even entering the thread.
You came here with zero good info pertaining to any of his questions. So what's the point of even stepping in. The point of this forum is to help the community, not bash them, say what they think is retarded, and that because we'd like to try and run nitrous that makes us a baby, and were whatever for being purists and for wanting to stay true to the gtps m90 style.


I know you'll say I'm wrong... and you're entitled to think that, I don't mind.

That's all I'm saying.


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WOW, I see turbo guys getting all het up and the regular mod guys TRYING to point out a guy MAY WANT TO PUSH A BLOWER PROJECT.
Lets all admit a 69 Camaro looks equally cool with a 6-71 sticking out of hood as much as popping hood and seeing twin snails boosting. OR seeing a 69 running 9 or 10 seconds on the bottle.
Its all hot rodding. Many think i am crazy wanting to twin turbo my 77 Monza, and with ebay GT2971Rs no less.
Buddy has embraced snail power and loves the GT series as he has INSTANT heat in Alaska, like in 30 seconds or less!
Now he has 38k on supposedly JUNK turbos, his truck is a S/C Lighting and he has done upgrades.
NOW he has last year Buick Regal GS and is working over the driveline. He called and asked about engine parts. And mods. He just did what father/son duo dod down road. Custom built rod piston package for less than ZZP/JE pistons. Used modified 4.3 Eagle rods, 2300 stroker pistons and has sent heads out for clean up, larger valves, and extrude hone finish.
He has decided to have cam built to match heads. Figure the blower will be 112. He has already figured out intercooler setup BEFORE blower and saw 12hp with it and temps under blower were considerably lower. I used to have his mock up pic but its buried now. Dang car can run down road on 80 degree day pulling 40 degree or less intake temps! Would have NEVER believed it but hell it only cost $1000+ to do. Figure with better blower he should get real good results.
Even toyed with swapping in a modified GMC blower for fun but local constabulary dislike hood exiting devices.
Gave ticket to guy with tunnel rammed rat rod even though guy can see ANYTHING as he installed cameras for blind spots(looks cool as rat rod guy used old electrical scrap to house his electronics!). Judge threw it out when guy took video and pics of car in and then my buddy had to take judges grandfathers wrecked 30s Ford and rebuild as rat rod. Judge even sprung for old road sign to rebuild firewall!.
BUT come on guys, guy wanted points for HIS plan. Interjecting a suggestion of turbo instead would be cool.
All this turbos only better way diatribe just push future members and fellow hot rodders away from here or out of business completely.
I see kids NOT understanding the joy of firing up an open header RWD fire breather for first time, smell the smoke and feel the cam.
I watched a kid, he spent $10k+ on having someone else install turbo kit, pull pistons to open up rings, head stud block, install all the other parts and it rolled out of trailer, kid took shower after paying bill. Drove to local hang out and couldnt answer a single question and looked sheepish when guys asked for details.
Car is for sale and kid is thinking of non performance car.
I asked kid why he didnt do part of work himself, turns out his daddy has $90k show car and hardest thing daddy did was write a check and polish it.
I told kid to find garage he could rent, start tearing things apart. Kid found a Civic Hatch and is NOW doing integra swap. For first time kids getting grease under his nails!
I am installing a 69k engine in my 04 GP tomorrow at work. I have 3 bell housing bolts, 3 or 4 plugs, flywheel bolts, starter, PS pump, and few other little things and old engine is OUT. Figure 2 hrs max with no issues. Then some prep and swap and stb engine in. HOPING to start about 1 again and have it running by 6 or so tomorrow as I am doing it at work on day off when shop is closed!.
Dont have everything I really need but Ill get new engine in and running asap then my GP will be DD and my 66 Caprice gets some off line love!

Folks, we all have dreams, I have known about Turbos for decades but didnt turn on to them till Ebay and Marty on Theturboforums.com and his GTA Firebird.

Now IF I had my druthers I would use Comp Turbo oilless or Aerocharger. Even toyed with building my own using remoted oiling system and turbine oil like Aerocharger idea.
Buddy even thought about an STS remote turbo setup. He found car with floor damage and bad fuel tank. Figured on modifying rear area for gas tank, mod floor to put turbo under rear seat, widen tunnel to handle pressure return and exit exhaust out in front of rear wheel.

All doable, all with different benefits.

Now as the regular guys say, stick to answering posters questions THEN interject possibly better way in turbo land. But shattering planners current blower ideas, generally runs people away and make the pusher seem like a phallic symbol.

I dont see 400 as hard as much as expensive.
Yes turbo eliminates certain issues. BUT sometimes its the journey not the destination. Kind of like getting to shag your fantasy movie star/famous sex fantasy. Its not popping your load in on around the proscribed area for the release. Its how you got there.

Honestly, I like the journey. My 98 Regal was one and I hated destroying it. Now I have a 04 Grand Prix and will SOON rip the N/A intake off, single belt balancer. Swap on my $73 Gen V, on my $100 ZZP intake, install some $200 stainless headers, install $75 worth of accessories. Swap in bigger injectors and pull out my $200 DHP tuner.
Again, it will be MY plan, MY journey and I may take advice, I may take different path.

Sorry this was so long.

OK back to sleep, got 2 or 3 hrs till getting up for church and then off to swap engine!

turbo people get their panties in a wad when people want to make power in different ways. Heaven forbid people do what they want. I would go with the XPZ instead of the Intense stage 4 blower cam. most people don't bother with bigger valves, don't know why, just never hear about it happening. the size injectors depends on fuel being used. if you are using pump 91/93 octane I think 42 lb injectors will be fine, but might be close to maxing them out. if you use E85, I would go with something bigger like 60's or 80's

IS4 is a super high revving cam, you don't need to rev the XPZ as high to make the same power.