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03-21-2013
Just like the title says, my car just spun a bearing and I'm looking around for a JY replacement. I found a few Series II's, 120K for $750, and 154k for $700. The kicker is I found a 155k Series III for $650. I haven't had the car long (3 weeks), so I haven't had much time to look into upgrades and whatnot, but I have seen the Series III a better setup. Should I buy the Series III and swap it in? What all is involved with the swap?
Last edited by Booba5185; 03-23-2013 at 02:17 PM.
03-21-2013
There's a difference between series 2/3 supercharged and series 2/3 non supercharged motors. Which are you looking at?
03-21-2013
You would need a throttle body adapter ($100) and that's all, as long as the new motor has the SC on it. And if it does..you are ahead of the game from the SC side.
Then swap your alt, ac bracket, map sensors and TB etc on .. you are good to go. Oh..and use the S3 evap. piece of cake.
03-21-2013
Where do you suggest getting the plate from? Will I need any tune or anything? I know the M90 is a more efficient setup, but will I gain any horsepower\torque or just reliability? It sounds like this is definitely the route I should go.
03-21-2013
Actually both motors are M90's, the S3 has the Gen V or newer version. There is some gain, but it's really just a slight cooler charge.
One thing I forgot. Hope that the black bracket is on the oil pan for the motor mount. If it is.. you'll need to remove the edge of the lip on the subframe bucket that holds that mount. This is the better aluminum oil pan and mount IMO. Or you can use the big horseshoe bracket with the mount and grind the bracket a little.
03-21-2013
I would think that it is there, since it is from a junkyard, but if it is not....will I be able to use the bracket\mount off of my current engine?
Also, will I need to do anything to the fuel rail or the PCV system?
03-21-2013
ZZP on the plate
Use your injectors and rail and map sensor and TB.
Yeah..you could use your bracket, with a touch of grinding to clear the aluminum pan. I'd prefer to buy the $12 bracket from the dealership. Search on aluminum pan and you'll likely find the bracket part number. Some yards don't leave them..I dunno.
03-21-2013
Awesome, thanks for the info. Looks like I'll be doing this swap then. Should I start another thread when the swap takes place or just post pics in this one? If I have any other questions on the swap I'll be posting them in here.
03-21-2013
Is the super charger gasket the same? I have a spare for my Gen III so I was wondering if I could use that on the Gen V?
03-21-2013
They are similar but not the same. Ports are in different places and I don't think you can interchange them.
Originally Posted by AmericanSoldier
03-22-2013
Thanks, So I've been adding everything up, minus the oil\coolant\cleaning materials to see the price difference. If I order everything from Rockauto (except the TB adapter of course), the price difference from Series II to Series III is a whooping $40.98. I do have a few questions though, are the exhaust manifold gaskets different? What about the rear main seal\block gasket? Does this look like everything I'd need for the most part?
Series II Series III Oreilly Rock Auto Oreilly Rock Auto Water Pump $42.99 $24.89 $42.99 $24.89 Timing Chain $47.99 $40.79 $47.99 $40.79 Oil Pan Gasket $51.99 $27.99 $51.99 $27.99 Rear Main Seal $15.99 $9.18 $24.99 $15.31 Timing Cover Gasket $14.99 $11.98 $14.99 $11.98 Valve Cover Gasket $61.99 $36.79 $61.99 $36.79 Exhaust Manifold Gasket $7.99 $4.80 $18.99 $10.41 Timing Dampener $19.99 $14.71 $19.99 $14.71 Super Charger Gasket $0.00 $0.00 $61.99 $8.75 Throttle Body Adapter $0.00 $0.00 $99.99 $99.99 Shipping $0.00 $13.31 $0.00 $41.11 Tax $24.41 $0.00 $27.00 $0.00 Parts Total $288.33 $184.44 $472.90 $332.72 Engine Price $750 $750 $650 $650 Engine Tax $54.8 $54.8 $47.5 $47.5 Grand total $1,093.08 $989.19 $1,170.35 $1,030.17 Rock Auto Series 2 vs. Series 3 price $40.98
Last edited by Booba5185; 03-22-2013 at 01:01 PM.
03-22-2013
I know the exhaust gasket is the same between all S2 & S3 3800s. GM# 24506057
The rear Crank Seals are the same as well. To my knowledge the block & gaskets are all the same between S2 & S3, its working parts that make the difference, crank/rods/pistons, sensors, heads, supercharger/intake manifold, etc... Core block is basically the same I think.
Rear crank oil seal - GM# 12582320
Rear crank cover gasket - GM# 24507388
^ same between 97-08 3800s, I checked.
Originally Posted by AmericanSoldier
03-22-2013
Awesome, I'll just get the ones for the S2 wince they are a tad bit cheaper. Thanks yet again.
03-22-2013
Oh I forgot to add, I already have the metal LIM gaskets on my old engine, I'll be reusing them.
03-22-2013
I wouldnt reuse used gaskets I dont trust them.
Originally Posted by The Sunfire Guy
03-22-2013
I've been told by quite a few people that I can reuse the metal ones. They've been on the car for all of a week, so they are still under warranty. If they leak then I'll replace then under that warranty. If I can make it look like they leaked, then I'll replace them before the engine goes in I guess.
03-22-2013
Yea, as funny as it sounds, they are NOT re-useable. Maybe if you just put the motor together and only went 1,000 miles or so... but I would just buy new. GM changed to the metal gaskets because the Dexcool was breaking down the plastic compound the original gaskets were made of, causing leaks.
Unless you ok with risking a leak inside the motor... just get new ones.
Originally Posted by AmericanSoldier
03-22-2013
You dont need a throttle body adapter if you rock the old blower/intake. You will also need a SC gasket either way you go about it. exhaust gaskets NEVER fail, they are MLS, and can be reused forever. Rear main seals are the same between s2 and s3, but I typically get S3 gaskets as they are typically an updated design. S3's dont use oilpan gaskets if they are aluminium, either way new oil pan gaskets are usually never needed as they will still leak... rebuilding a stock gasket with RTV is usually the best choice.
For the record, i have taken my LIM off my turbo car more than a few times and reused the alum LIM gasket.
03-22-2013
I was always told not to reuse them.
You say you have used them without any problems?
Originally Posted by The Sunfire Guy
03-22-2013
There's maybe 8 miles on the new gaskets in the old motor.
it's out of a 2004 so it should have a aluminum oil pan correct? So no oil pan gasket? My current M90 has 230k on it, so I'll use the Gen V m90 (150k). I'll hold off on the exhaust gaskets then, thanks for that advice.
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