Thread: 4t65e HD Rebuild (Question is for Trannyman95 or any other Tranny GURU)

Testing to see if my sig works

You have most everything covered. Im not a fan of the Raybestos clutches but they will work ok. I use Borg Warner OE replacement frictions in all of my builds. The 01+ bands are High Energy friction material, the older ones are regular lining which works fine also. Not sure why you want to upgrade the input sprag as its a waste of money that wont gain you anything. I have never seen a "GOOD" older style sprag fail. Takes yours apart and inspect the elements and if the races are good you can by new sprags for them if you want to replace them. There is really no reason to go with the newer style ratcheting sprag. If you do opt to swap one in then you will need the 03+ input friction plates as the splines are different and the earlier ones wont fit. I use Transgo shift kits as a base in my builds and make a few other changes of my own in conjunction with the kit. You wont need to buy a Sonnax boost valve as the Transgo kit includes upgraded valves for the stock setup. The Superior kit works OK but you dont need it if you are planning on replacing the TCC and boost valves in the valve body. The Sonnax Sure-Cure kit includes these valves also and also includes a new TFL valve that goes in the channel plate which requires expensive tooling to use and its not worth the cost as new channel plates are cheaper than the tooling, and I rarely see a problem in this area. You will also likely need to replace a handful of bushings and thrust washers in the trans. For torque converters I only prefer using stock reman'd converters for M90 cars. I have never had one fail because it was at fault and they stall plenty high in stock form. I have mixed feelings on the pumps shaft. It is a nice piece but havent found a reason to require one. I have seen stock shafts have worn splines after very high mileage but otherwise not a concern area to me. The input clutch apply piston that you mention on my website being New or Reconditioned.... The reconditioned part is a used OE part that has been refinished on the inner sealing surface which is the problem area on this part.

All of the bands interchange no problem, you can use older bands in newer and newer bands in older trans as long as they are 4T65E parts. The 01+ HE bands will go backwards just fine. Sorry I wasnt very clear above when I mentioned the earlier bands worked fine also.

HE bands usually have a higher static coefficient of friction, so they have more holding power. The forward and reverse bands are essentially static clutches, they do not see heat from dynamic friction that your clutch packs would see (unless they slip). The only band that sees dynamic friction is the manual 1-2 band when you manually drop into 2 or 1 from a roll.

If you can, get a high energy manual band. I think Raybestos offers one.

For a shifting clutch, like the manual band IF pulling down for engine braking, the HE friction material is more durable. For the bands I have no preferrence though if you have to buy them they are very close in price and the HE lining is a little better. If the forward or reverse bands are burnt it was for a reason, not because the band wasnt doing its job. I have also find that HE linings generally like a little higher pressure to get the job done for shifting clutches but they will tolerate slippage or slow engagements much better than normal tan or paper linings will. HE frictions are great and I have been using them in 700R4/4L60E performance builds for a long time with great results.

Trannyman

I want to make sure I have no valve body issues down the road as I understand a lot of people seem to have issues when they get higher mileage. What would you replace in the valve body:

All 4 sensors
Upgraded Boost valve
Upgraded TC valve

Ect:


I don't have the tranny experience that you have to know what I should do and what I shouldn't do because its over kill.

I always replace all 4 solenoids during a rebuild regardless of the history of them. Its worth the small extra cost to cover your back here instead of a month after the trans is back in the car have a solenoid crap out and then look at all of the labor involved! Its just foolish in my eyes to gamble some something like solenoids. There are companies with actual valve body testing machines that will run warm trans fluid through and test the functionality of the valve body and solenoids and if that checks ok then they are probably safe to reuse. A lot of aftermarket reman valve body companies do this and it is perfectly fine. Most guys dont have a $50K machine to do this so replacing the solenoids is the best and safest option. I also upgrade the boost valve with one the comes in the Transgo kit, or if not using that one then a Sonnax boost valve goes in. The I replace both the TCC switch valve and regulated apply valves. Most 98+ valve bodies have hard anodized valves, dark in color, and they seem to hold up pretty well and not wear like the earlier ones but the valve body bores still wear and cause problems. On the 97-mid 00 valve bodies there are forward and reverse servo boost valves and I like replacing as a minimal the forward one with a Sonnax valve to make sure the forward band has good solid apply. Something else to make sure you check out is the pressure switch manifold. This can be tested with an ohm meter or one that tests continuity and half of the switches are normally open while the other half are normally closed. After that is verified and the assembly is good I replace all of the oring seals on the switches. New ones are included in the gasket kit. There are other valves that can be replaced but I just never has seen the necessitiy of them. If the valve body is in that bad of shape and cant be cleaned up then its best to replace it.

I thought the transgo shift kit just has springs and spacers that go into the accumulator. I installed the wbody shift kit about 1.5 years ago and I'm going to remove that and install the transgo in its place. So your saying that the trango kit has more than just springs and spacers in it?

Trannyman

I just saw on your triple edge performance home page that you are selling the modified gear set so we can run 7/8 chains. Are these the same gears (modified 4t60) that zzp/wbody store uses, and how much power would you rate those chains for. I'm definitely going to pick one up from you when I start piecing my kit together in the next month.

Oh yeah, do you have one of the 4t65e transgo kits that you can open up and take a picture of. I would like to see whats inside before I purchase one.

Thanks
Jeff

I finally found my camera cable the other night, its been missing for a month!, so I will take a pic of the shift kit parts and yes there is more to it than just the springs and spacers that go into the 1-2/2-3 accumulator housing. The 7/8 single chain sets are identical to the other sets out there and are modified 4T60E HyVo gear sets and include a new Morse / Borg Warner HyVo chain. The gears are all modified on a cnc mill and lathe so they come out the same very time with tight tolerences. I will try to take a pic of the gear sets also, I have them in 2.93, 3.29, and 3.69 ratios also. I believe the W-body store chain set uses a 15/16" chain which is an older style chain that was used in the earlier 4T60 transmissions and has what is referred to as a roller pin, rather than the rocker style pin on the HyVo chain sets. There is a lot of debate as to which is actually stronger and there isnt a clear answer to that as far as I know, but GM switched to the HyVo chains for strength reasons and the 15/16" chain only measures wider than the 7/8" chain because there are extra links on the outside row, which still gives the same tooth contact as the 7/8" chain does. Confused yet? lol

Yeah I knew about the difference between wbody and zzp chains. Both of them say their chain setup is stronger, which to me doesn't really matter since I'm not planning on pushing more than 350 hp. I'm going with the 7/8 chain since I've known about GM using that prior to switch to the 1 inch GM racing chain which costs alone like $850+.

Do you have those gear sets out yet, if not when are you expecting to release them (I'm sticking with the 2.93)? I preper the better gas mileage.

I have been selling my gearsets for a few years and have the machined gears ready to ship out.

What happened to the last few posts in this thread, they are deleted

Now it reappears, there was no 2nd page that I could click on and now after I post if pops up.

Not sure, it all looks there to me!

I was just happy posts weren't disappearing like clubgp